Hey guys thought if anybody could help, you guys would
My car is finally due for a smog check, but I have a CEL on and I also have the RK header (first design?)...
anyway, dude at the smog place saw the CEL told me I wouldn't pass, i told him I could reset it, he says still wouldn't pass
something about 95+ cars not passing even after CEL was reset
so I'm trying to weigh my options here
he told me to get a new o2 sensor, and that might solve it and be able to pass.
but I'm afraid even if I get the sensor the header will still throw the code?
I
REALLY don't want to find and/or get a new stock header
what would you guys do?
thanksinadvance!
What's the code? rear o2 sensor or front?
not sure? guess I should go to autozone and check?
I didn't do the smog check cuz the guy told me i wouldn't pass.
he says he could check it, but I'd have to pay him for a failed test.
(Nice car BTW)
just my luck....
..they don't check codes in CA anymore...
however that still makes me think that even if I replace the sensor, will the code come back because of the header?
Will I ultimately have to replace the header is the question?
I sure f'n hope not....
bump for email
I'm surprised this hasn't happened to other people
you need to scan the code and find out what it is, even if that means you have to pay a shop $75 to do it for you. as long as you have an obd 2 compliant cat, there is no reason why the header would cause an o2 sensor code. however, there are thousands of other problems that can cause codes. throwing a new o2 sensor on without even scanning the code would be really stupid.
87 Firebird
All stock...........lol.
google "spark plug anti-fouler" or "header anti-fouler"
i dont know much about it personally but its a very common problem when installing aftermarket headers apparently... worth looking into for a couple bucks...
randizzle wrote:you need to scan the code and find out what it is, even if that means you have to pay a shop $75 to do it for you. as long as you have an obd 2 compliant cat, there is no reason why the header would cause an o2 sensor code. however, there are thousands of other problems that can cause codes.
I'm pretty sure it has to do with the header, I don't remember having a CEL before installing it. What I'm wondering is if I will or will not pass smog. The guy there told me
I wouldn't pass even if I reset it. Well I have a buddy that works at Kragen, maybe I see if they still have that code reader tool and if he can sneak a scan. Or maybe he knows a guy that knows a guy.
randizzle wrote: throwing a new o2 sensor on without even scanning the code would be really stupid.
Exactly what I was thinking
paul bateman wrote:google "spark plug anti-fouler" or "header anti-fouler"
i dont know much about it personally but its a very common problem when installing aftermarket headers apparently... worth looking into for a couple bucks...
I don't have a problem with the light being on, I'm just worried about wasting money failing smog tests. From the posts that google came up with, they only mentioned
the light and nothing about emissions or anything like that. I will look into it some more tho...
thanks for your help guys. !
if the light is on, you fail. period. you need to find out what is wrong, and it starts with a scan. it could be as simple as the gas cap.
87 Firebird
All stock...........lol.
have you actually failed a test yet? and is your test center also a repair shop? if so.. run away... lol... a CEL is just that... a light... you wont fail simply because it came on at some point... clear the code and they dont know @!#$... unless there IS an underlying problem...
the ecu is using sensors to determine many things.. but it also assumes the stock manifold is in place and the O2 sensor is exactly where its supposed to be physically etc etc etc... Speculating at this point, i dont have a header installed... but from reading... aftermarket headers are obviously way different then a stock manifold.. move the sensor a couple inches and you'll get different data, not to mention much higher exhaust flow.. and possibly make the ECU think your car is not running properly and it will start making weird adjustments based on incorrect data.. But If you can make that light go out, then the sensor is now within normal limits... someone feel free to correct me if im wrong...
unplugging the blub is just "making the light go off".. hehe
ok.. upon reading more on this, i was off a bit... man im bored.. lol
people use the anti-foulers to mimic a cat converter by pulling the 2nd o2 sensor out of the exhaust stream a bit... but yes, it has nothing to do with affecting performance in any way (2nd sensor simply checks the first) so its for turning off a light that has no meaning... they obvious know they have no catalytic converter, so there is no need for the light to be on masking any other potential DTC..
If you do have a cat in your application, odds are you need a high-flow cat installed... that seems to be a common solution as well...
As for the mechanic.. He prolly meant you cant pass a smog test with an active CEL, everywhere does that... But if you clear the code (and can keep it off for the duration of the test) then they will have no idea it was ever on... so provided your actual tailpipe emissions are good, so are you... But again... I dont think anyone is passing a tailpipe test without a cat installed or some serious tuning... i could be wrong...
again.. im not an expert... just a bored guy somewhat interested by this thread giving his 2 cents..
So yeah. I'm gonna get scanned and see what code I'm throwing out.
Guess I'm gonna hit up a dealer and see how much they're gonna charge to scan me.
My buddy @ kragen told me the scanners are
illegal in cali so im SOL on that one.
And even if I did reset it, it takes a couple days for the ECU to get a good reading and then throw a code
if i reset and tested, it would read out that its been reset and wouldn't let me pass anyway.
Sucks to be me right now~
I'll ask the local chevy dealer how much and how soon I can go in.
I'll update if anyone is interested
and thanks again guys. I needed some straight answers, I knew you guys would help.
scanners are certainly NOT illegal anywhere... radar scanners, sure... but not obd scanners...
if you own a laptop, you can buy a obd-usb interface from ebay (i got mine for a penny plus shipping.. lol.. no joke) and use the laptop as your scanner.. also works with wifi dongle / iphone etc... or buy a stand-alone scanner for like $100...
either way.. they are an incredibly useful tool for the DIYer... but from what i've heard, many part stores will run a scan for free....
you know what... I'm tripping too much about this.
This mechanic guy was recommended to me by my buddy and he told me he would pass me.
So if I have no light, than he'll pass me.
So I just need to get rid of the light.
So I'll take a chance on a"spark plug anti-fouler" or "header anti-fouler" and maybe that will do it.
I'll do some more research on it tho. Thanks again guys
If you're in socal, I can check the code for you. If you reset the code, it resets the engine readiness monitors, so what has to happen then is all the monitors (tests) have to set. this could take several driving cycles.
Unfortunately, I'm in what you'd call "mid" Cal. By San Jose, home of the Sharks
I appreciate the offer though!
I'm gonna have to wait till I have a chance to see a dealer, and they're only open weekdays.
I might not have a chance until next friday.... Boooooooo
Is the cali smog check anything like the ontario clean air emissions testing? If so do the test and if you fail they'll tell you why, and if the cost to fix is over the fix limit (Think it was around $400) you'll get a default pass and have to pay nothing but the test cost ($40 CAD)
that rk header is gonna fail you on Ca. visual inspection. but not all places actually do it. its not street or smog legal in ca. only the pacesetter headers are. around here some smog shops even if they fail you you can come back for a retest. im in vallejo if your near by i can check it for you .
Shane Reid wrote:Is the cali smog check anything like the ontario clean air emissions testing? If so do the test and if you fail they'll tell you why, and if the cost to fix is over the fix limit (Think it was around $400) you'll get a default pass and have to pay nothing but the test cost ($40 CAD)
pretty sure you have to actually make the $400 in repairs to get the conditional pass and then you cant transfer the ownership so selling the car will be tricky... i learned this the hard way..
I had to make all repairs and get the car to pass just to transfer the ownership over to me... cond. pass isnt good enough so there is no limit.. luckily it was ~400 anyways..
Ok so finally got myself to a dealer yesterday and broke it down to him
told me they would have to "diagnose" my car to see what was wrong, that the codes only give them "a general direction of the problem"
I had a feeling he was giving me the dealer service writer talk that he gives every soccer mom that goes in there.
So i'm thinking about just scanning the shyt myself. I checked ebay and they have some cheap, and I'm hoping they work?
like
This oNe or
This one?
What a fuggin hassle this is...
I appreciate everyone's responses though, I don't know much about the smog check-this is my first ever.
So thanks again
I use
this one
bought from the same seller for a penny.. the software is a bit flaky but you can find and download any ELM327 based program.. but it works..
paul bateman wrote:I use this one
bought from the same seller for a penny.. the software is a bit flaky but you can find and download any ELM327 based program.. but it works..
Awesome! I found one just like it, for a penny! I bid 2 pennies!
As long as it works I'm good!
thanks paul
no prob.. i figured for the cost, it was worth a shot... But sure enough, it works just fine... after some playing..
Just make sure to install the usb driver on the disk.. then look in device manager to see which COM port its using.. on my thinkpad with xp, it defaulted to COM4
People that bitch that these dont work are either using it on a car thats not supported by either the interface or the software (usually only brand new cars) or they are messing up the com port or baud rate.. its a simple serial connection thats been around since the 60's, not exactly high-tech.. lol.. its all in the software you use that depends on if it works or not..
Most of the software would not work by default.. i had to change these settings around.. But once i set everything to COM4 and 38400 baud rate, they all worked..
it included basic software for reading codes.. But you can get more advanced programs online.. Digimoto works fairly well... The PIDs supported on our cars is limited, so there isnt a ton of info there.. But on the better software, you can at least view freeze-frame data, real-time data such as o2 sensor and fuel trims, timing etc or use the laptop for virtual gauges.. i wouldnt recommend it tho... lol... i almost killed myself trying to look at the laptop and drive at the same time..
good luck with your problem.. and enjoy your toy.. lol.. gives you that fast and furious feel as your driving along
well good news...if anyone's still interested...
...turns out a buddy of mine at school used to be a tech at a dealer so he had a code reader!
he scanned my car and it was throwing these codes:
P0133
P133gm
P0422
P0130
according to the CEL FAQ:
P0133 HO2S Slow Response Bank 1 Sensor 1
P0422 Catalyst System Low Efficiency Bank 1
P0130 HO2S Circuit Closed Loop (CL) Performance Bank 1 Sensor 1
He told me it couldn't the sensor, they don't go bad for 100K+ miles?
Most likely its an exhaust leak?
He also told me he used to do smog checks and they don't even check the computer UNLESS there IS a CEL on.
SO maybe I'll just get the codes erased and then get a smog check....?
suggestions?....
thanks!
