Ok folks...Ive got some questions about cams for the eco, I searched and came up with way more than I have time to dig through. Heres my basic questions:
Are there any cams that I can put in my 04 eco that wont kill driveability/idle, wont kill low-mid range torque and dont require a ton of support mods such as tuning and injectors...basically are any of them DD friendly and simply install and drive?
I might be able to convince myself to fork out a couple hundred $$ for cams and installation, but adding tuning, injectors, etc just isnt budget friendly, especially for a relatively small HP gain.
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comp stage 1 and the LZM tri-flow grinds kind of meet your criteria. You will always benefit from tuning obviously, but it is recommended for any change in cams to tune the car and grab higher flowing injectors. The stockers do not have much duty cycle to spare, and when you go and increase airflow you're likely going to max them. Even something like ford red top 30lb/hr will put you in a safe place.
I would suggest maybe a Comp Cam Stage 2, would require a tune anyway and i think the stock valve train can handle a few hundred more rpms and lift, but i dont know the exact numbers
-Ben
Ben Wenzel Jr wrote:I would suggest maybe a Comp Cam Stage 2, would require a tune anyway and i think the stock valve train can handle a few hundred more rpms and lift, but i dont know the exact numbers
-Ben
It cant. Im pretty sure it was Jon(Airtonics) and someone else tested the stock valvesprings and they were no where near able to support Comps Stage 1 cams.
ok but really how hard would it be the change out your valves and springs and cams and have a very nice street car? so your lookin at maybe a thou, and gain an easy 15whp ?
i paid $1100 just for my current cams, and not sure on my results, getting the car back together now, will hit the dyno and let ya know
-Ben
Tinkles wrote:Ben Wenzel Jr wrote:I would suggest maybe a Comp Cam Stage 2, would require a tune anyway and i think the stock valve train can handle a few hundred more rpms and lift, but i dont know the exact numbers
-Ben
It cant. Im pretty sure it was Jon(Airtonics) and someone else tested the stock valvesprings and they were no where near able to support Comps Stage 1 cams.
yeah jon found out that really none of them are good enough to out wit coil bind. ended up with PSI valve springs but he had to bore the spring seats out to fit them. but they wont coil bind up to 8000.
this is a topic i am not going to argue
but i will say a few things, i have the ferrea springs got them from florida, i currently have them "installed height" around 1.28" i turn my engine over and take a fueler gauge and the .050 fits loose ( like throwing a hot dog down a hallway) some will get that some wont
and thats with guessing again 120ish seat and 250ish over the nose pressure, and and and i have free reved my car over 9000 when i would miss shifts with my F23, so in summery my springs have had zero problems without maching the head.
say what you want i know nothing right
-Ben
Ronin J wrote:Ok folks...Ive got some questions about cams for the eco, I searched and came up with way more than I have time to dig through. Heres my basic questions:
Are there any cams that I can put in my 04 eco that wont kill driveability/idle, wont kill low-mid range torque and dont require a ton of support mods such as tuning and injectors...basically are any of them DD friendly and simply install and drive?
I might be able to convince myself to fork out a couple hundred $$ for cams and installation, but adding tuning, injectors, etc just isnt budget friendly, especially for a relatively small HP gain.
Yup the Comp Cams stage 1 we carry is what you will want. Check them out.
-Aaron
www.TurboTechRacing.com
Performance Parts For Cavalier, Sunfire, Cobalts and More!!!
Ben Wenzel Jr wrote:ok but really how hard would it be the change out your valves and springs and cams and have a very nice street car? so your lookin at maybe a thou, and gain an easy 15whp ?
i paid $1100 just for my current cams, and not sure on my results, getting the car back together now, will hit the dyno and let ya know
-Ben
See that was pretty much my point...$1000 (Im assuming thats just parts not labor to install) for 15 hp really isnt worth it to me. If there was a set of cams that would work alone, or maybe with a simple injector upgrade Id consider it, but getting into all the rest blows the cost way out of my range.
We are talking a car that runs 16.7 in the 1/4 w intake, TB, ported manifolds and 2 1/4" exhaust. Another 15 hp probably wouldnt even get it out of the 16s...just not worth it for a grand...or even more since I dont have the tools or experience to swap cams, valves springs, etc.
Anyhow thanks for the info guys.
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Look at it this way
for me . . . it was "about" every $100 was worth 1 yes i said one WHP, i have gained about 70WHP since i started, now agian i am all motor, but besides the pistons intake and exaust, i could have went turbo (another story) this story my intake gained me about 20WHP but i also spent: several hundred on a 75mm TB several hundred on alum plates and piping. those things alone do nothing, its all in the design. anyway my point is: some times you have to spend on things that individualy dont gain, but in the long run will let you gain way more. another example my exaust: i do belive i spent around 500ish on piping and fancy merge collector, again its just parts, i had told a race buddy of mine to step the pipes and a certain length, and charged me 600, so 1100 later how much on the dyno did it gain me . . . zero! but . . . i allmost went 105mph twice, before that 104mph once and struggled to hit 103mph. yes i am just rambling but my point:
a thou for springs cams and valves . . . YES and get a tune, it "could" be more than 15WHP, o i just remembered 20WHP is ALOT ! i could keep going on but just after i installed my intake i drove it to the dyno holy cow, YES 20 is like downshifting then hold on !
ok im done for now
-Ben
cams without tuning? why bother.
if you don't want to do the supporting mods, save your money.
wow .. .scary... i just spent the same on my exhaust...
but then again the pacesetter setup i have now is not the best...
whew i had to breath
i got exausted just reading my own post
anyway i agree with PJ
do whats best for you, i choose drag racing, you could choose mild street car, bottom line how much do you want to spend and/or how fast do you want to go?
-Ben
DaFlyinSkwirl (Pj) v2.0 wrote:cams without tuning? why bother.
if you don't want to do the supporting mods, save your money.
Its not that I dont want to, its that I cant afford to at this point in time. Thats why I was wondering if there were any cams that were essentially "install and go". It seems the answer is no, but thats fine. It was just an idea I was tossing around.
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if you want fast and cheap buy a nitrous setup.
blucavvy wrote:if you want fast and cheap buy a nitrous setup.
Considered it, but I cant afford to replace a motor, and no car = no work...not good with a family of 4 to support.
I think Im gonna put on a decent header and call the performance end done. Next after that will probably be a set of sway bars. Then maybe 2 tone paint, big maybe.
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Ronin J wrote:blucavvy wrote:if you want fast and cheap buy a nitrous setup.
Considered it, but I cant afford to replace a motor, and no car = no work...not good with a family of 4 to support.
I think Im gonna put on a decent header and call the performance end done. Next after that will probably be a set of sway bars. Then maybe 2 tone paint, big maybe.
what makes you think you will need to replace your engine with nitrous?
Im a Xbox 360 fanboy...and damn proud of it!!
99redz24 wrote:Ronin J wrote:blucavvy wrote:if you want fast and cheap buy a nitrous setup.
Considered it, but I cant afford to replace a motor, and no car = no work...not good with a family of 4 to support.
I think Im gonna put on a decent header and call the performance end done. Next after that will probably be a set of sway bars. Then maybe 2 tone paint, big maybe.
what makes you think you will need to replace your engine with nitrous?
I dont trust the stuff...seen too many peoples engines go POP. Im not a huge fan of it in the first place, I like something thats there all the time...but Ive considered the stuff and decided no. Also the ecos seem to have an issue with it pooling in the intake and backfiring, which I believe breaks the plastic manifold...a relatively easy fix but just another check for the cons list.
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there are precautions you can take to make it safe and reliable. do some reading up on it and you might be surprised.
