I was thinking of redoing my gauge cluster when I had this idea. Rather than rewire the whole car can't you just use Autometer or some other gauges that are not run by the computer and save alot of rewiring? I'm not swapping engines personaly but plan on swapping out the cluster for a custom, more accurate setup for when I go boosted.


The Outlaw
98 Pontiac Sunfire (Christine)
2200 5spd
Red with Black racing stripes.

Don't let the punks get to you. If they can't say anything helpful its because they probably
have VERY LITTLE IF ANY MECHANICAL SKILLS . Talking crap is just their way of hiding that
fact. They figure the more crap they say the less likley anyone will know how dumb they are.

really you didn't think of anything and accually its not an easier way

the V6 guys have know this for a long time, but all you do is switch the dash wiring on your car and your set thers no rewiring really maybe the Evap but nothing big. personally i have autometer gauges and i may go stock 00+ gauges 1 day

for the autometer gauges you will be looking at almost 600 bucks but if you buy a parts car you have everything you need and since your pre 00 you should be buying a parts car anyways



JBO since July 30, 2001

I'm not swapping my engine. I am swapping out my gauges for more ACCURATE ones. I was just thinking it would be a better option. for the people doing the eco swap. If not OK. The stock cluster does not suite my needs. It barely provides you with any info and its a joke. I mean come on Volt and oil pressure gauges should've been part of the cluster from the factory. I am also doing alot more than the cluster. I'm doing a triple gauge pillar and 2 more in the cubby hole in front of the shifter. I'll have speedo,tach, volts, boost, oil pressure and temp, coolant temp, fuel level and pressure, A/F, and EGT. That way when I build and boost my engine it will be well monitored. Now before you say I don't need all that I do. I'm building my car for autocross and the bonneville salt flats after I have the custom gearset made for the transmission.


The Outlaw
98 Pontiac Sunfire (Christine)
2200 5spd
Red with Black racing stripes.

Don't let the punks get to you. If they can't say anything helpful its because they probably
have VERY LITTLE IF ANY MECHANICAL SKILLS . Talking crap is just their way of hiding that
fact. They figure the more crap they say the less likley anyone will know how dumb they are.

And for a good set of gauges, you will be paying a good amount of cash.

yea, but with what he's doing, i'd say its worth it...besides, its what he wants to do.

i swapped and ecotec into my 2000 about three years ago with no problem at all other than a fuel pump dying. body work is more difficult i think... I would say swap the thing.

I wasn't saying don't do it, hell I did, that's how I know about the cost.

trust me i know the cost of running autometers
all Sport Comp series
Speedo 189
tach 129
fuel level 59
Boost 59
Volt 49
Water temp 49
oil temp 49
oil pressure 59
total 642 before taxes i got a bunch of them used lucky for me, but everyone is aware of the options its not like this is new, but why pay for a 4 of those gauges when you can have them cheap by using a stock cluster then buy the ones you need and get a pod, those 4 guages are 426 you can run a stock cluster for less then 426

KEEP IN MIND THOSE ARE MY PRICES FROM MY SPEED SHOP IN CANADA its an example.

then with the autometers you have no highbeam light (i drove around for 2 days with them on and had no clue, no CEL good to know if theres a fault, just little things this is what my setup looks like if i have the info i have no when i did this i would have a stock cluster in my car, issak wanna be my test subject



JBO since July 30, 2001

before

after


PS getting 6 guages into an 00-05 bezel doesn't work i tried the opening isn't very large the 95-99 bezel fits them, the at the bottom i have my turn signal, high beam, brake, CEL, and security which my alarm will be hooked up to when i put it in so that LED flashes insted of drilling 1 in my dash



JBO since July 30, 2001

the outlaw wrote:I'm not swapping my engine. I am swapping out my gauges for more ACCURATE ones. I was just thinking it would be a better option. for the people doing the eco swap. If not OK. The stock cluster does not suite my needs. It barely provides you with any info and its a joke. I mean come on Volt and oil pressure gauges should've been part of the cluster from the factory. I am also doing alot more than the cluster. I'm doing a triple gauge pillar and 2 more in the cubby hole in front of the shifter. I'll have speedo,tach, volts, boost, oil pressure and temp, coolant temp, fuel level and pressure, A/F, and EGT. That way when I build and boost my engine it will be well monitored. Now before you say I don't need all that I do. I'm building my car for autocross and the bonneville salt flats after I have the custom gearset made for the transmission.

Wat does a volt gauge give you? I can see for a setup that has a stereo, but there's not a lot of information you get from volts...

Oil pressure isn't available because there is no oil pressure sensor...

Remember, these cars were budget grocery getters for lower middle class and elderly. They were never meant to be turned into what we are doing with them.





4cyltuner.com - Information Source For 4 Cylinder Tuners
Buy stuff from CarCustoms Ebay! Won't be disappointed!

sweet freaking gauge setup...





Needing 2.3 oil pump stuff? PM me...

I've always liked this idea, but I don't think there is a way around re-wiring the whole car for the 95-99 eco swap. COMPLETELY different wiring diagrams.

Biggest issue...How are you still planning on getting around the VATS? Which in the 00+ is linked through the PCM, BCM and cluster?

Standalone will do it yes... or HPtuners. But you need all the wiring already in the car in order to turn that @!#$ off..

Good luck with the gauges tho!





Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Tuesday, February 10, 2009 5:43 PM

its called a donor car you take all the wiring out of the dono 00+ and put it in the 95-99 its not a hard job its a dink but then your can basicly becomes a 00

gus here are getting complete donor cars for 6-800 CDN a budy and ijust stripped an 04 eco cav on the weekend so for 800 you get all the wiring engine everything and you wanna spend 600 on just gauges and still not have things

shifted they do have an oil pressure sensor on the j bodys. and oil pressure guage isn't gonna help you any because you wont look at it all the time it will be like your coolent temp how offen do you look at that, atleast when a light comes on it catches your eye

if i do mine i will run a stock guges and then get oil temp, boost, EGT in a gauge pod and thats it



JBO since July 30, 2001

Cody@RDFabs.com wrote:I've always liked this idea, but I don't think there is a way around re-wiring the whole car for the 95-99 eco swap. COMPLETELY different wiring diagrams.

Biggest issue...How are you still planning on getting around the VATS? Which in the 00+ is linked through the PCM, BCM and cluster?

Standalone will do it yes... or HPtuners. But you need all the wiring already in the car in order to turn that @!#$ off..

Good luck with the gauges tho!

VATS doesn't require the cluster to be there in the 00+.





4cyltuner.com - Information Source For 4 Cylinder Tuners
Buy stuff from CarCustoms Ebay! Won't be disappointed!

doesn't matter if you swap then eco engine harness and the 00+ interior harness your vats will then be the 00 style i just think thats the better way,

you can have a 95-99 shell swap the wiring to the @k style then you will have the BCM and everything just have to remembe ryour 2000 wiring not 95-99



JBO since July 30, 2001

NOTa2_4 wrote:trust me i know the cost of running autometers
all Sport Comp series
Speedo 189
tach 129
fuel level 59
Boost 59
Volt 49
Water temp 49
oil temp 49
oil pressure 59
total 642 before taxes i got a bunch of them used lucky for me, but everyone is aware of the options its not like this is new, but why pay for a 4 of those gauges when you can have them cheap by using a stock cluster then buy the ones you need and get a pod, those 4 guages are 426 you can run a stock cluster for less then 426

KEEP IN MIND THOSE ARE MY PRICES FROM MY SPEED SHOP IN CANADA its an example.

then with the autometers you have no highbeam light (i drove around for 2 days with them on and had no clue, no CEL good to know if theres a fault, just little things this is what my setup looks like if i have the info i have no when i did this i would have a stock cluster in my car, issak wanna be my test subject

Test subject for what exactly? I don't get it...

NOTa2_4 wrote:trust me i know the cost of running autometers
all Sport Comp series
Speedo 189
tach 129
fuel level 59
Boost 59
Volt 49
Water temp 49
oil temp 49
oil pressure 59
total 642 before taxes i got a bunch of them used lucky for me, but everyone is aware of the options its not like this is new, but why pay for a 4 of those gauges when you can have them cheap by using a stock cluster then buy the ones you need and get a pod, those 4 guages are 426 you can run a stock cluster for less then 426

KEEP IN MIND THOSE ARE MY PRICES FROM MY SPEED SHOP IN CANADA its an example.

then with the autometers you have no highbeam light (i drove around for 2 days with them on and had no clue, no CEL good to know if theres a fault, just little things this is what my setup looks like if i have the info i have no when i did this i would have a stock cluster in my car, issak wanna be my test subject

I know its not going to be cheap. As far as the indicator lights go if you can find the wires to those circuits you can install your own lights into your custom panel.

Shifted the purpose of a Volt gauge is to keep you aware of the status of your electrical system. A volt gauge will let you know if your alternator is working fine and if there is any excessive power draws.



The Outlaw
98 Pontiac Sunfire (Christine)
2200 5spd
Red with Black racing stripes.

Don't let the punks get to you. If they can't say anything helpful its because they probably
have VERY LITTLE IF ANY MECHANICAL SKILLS . Talking crap is just their way of hiding that
fact. They figure the more crap they say the less likley anyone will know how dumb they are.

Actually an Ammeter will serve that purpose better than a volt gauge. A bad battery can put out 12v just fine, and a bad alternator can put out 14.4 volts without a problem... A volt meter will not tell you about "excessive power draws" since your volt's don't go up when you add things, but your amp draw does.





Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Wednesday, February 11, 2009 8:14 AM


4cyltuner.com - Information Source For 4 Cylinder Tuners
Buy stuff from CarCustoms Ebay! Won't be disappointed!

Sorry but the point of this post was a way to make the pre 00 Eco swap easier. Doing custom gauges won't. Even if you did custom gauges you still need the wiring for the BCM which you have to have. Also fuel lines, and tank are different. the Eco swap can be done without swapping all this, but requires hard wiring, making things work etc... If you take a donor car and swap everything it keeps it plug and play. If it is a race car then plug and play is not as big of a deal, but a daily driver that you might sell should try to keep plug and play.



FU Tuning

^^Yah...a rewire is not hard at all.....you can easily do it in a weekend.

If you want a race car or more accurate gauges then go with the autometer ones.

we are accually doin an ecoswap at this years JCO bash its in an 00+ but were gonna run the car friday night as a 2200 then swap the motor to an eco for saturday, thanks to darren and his thinking out loud

issak we'll talk on MSN



JBO since July 30, 2001

NOTa2_4 wrote:we are accually doin an ecoswap at this years JCO bash its in an 00+ but were gonna run the car friday night as a 2200 then swap the motor to an eco for saturday, thanks to darren and his thinking out loud

issak we'll talk on MSN

I have a quick question could the engine (eco) run if the bcm and cluster werent installed?

in a 2000+ not sure but you can put the eco in an older car say 95-99 and not swap it all in and still run it but the thing people aren't understanding here is this
2000+ it drops in no major issues
pre 2000 you have to change a bunch of things so your best to buy a donor car so if you have donor car WHY NOT swap the stuff and run it properly yeah its a little more work but why not make it look like it came that way



JBO since July 30, 2001

NOTa2_4 wrote:in a 2000+ not sure but you can put the eco in an older car say 95-99 and not swap it all in and still run it but the thing people aren't understanding here is this
2000+ it drops in no major issues
pre 2000 you have to change a bunch of things so your best to buy a donor car so if you have donor car WHY NOT swap the stuff and run it properly yeah its a little more work but why not make it look like it came that way

well with me im putting one in a s10 and dont need everything hooked up, just the engine and obd port...