So i am in the process of begining my aurora 4.0 swap into my 2004 eco powered cavalier and have been trying to decide what to do with the old eco. it just turned over 100k miles and has been very well maintained but deffinitly abused over the years (no rattleing on first start after a oil change, no smoking, no sign of being ready to die). I have decided that in the name of science i am going to kill it (unless it really is built as well as gm says) . It currently has a rear mounted turbo with a peek boost of 5 psi, a blazer fuel pump (65 psi), header into straight pipe all the way to turbo, and 92 octane fuel. So a couple nights ago i removed the vacuum line to the wastegate and WHAM 10-12 pounds. There is no spark knock and it dosent lean out enough to misfire but it is un-tuned so destruction should come eventually (maybe) also the auto trans is not showing any signs of slippage or distress during shifting that i can tell which i didnt see coming . It will be going to a dyno though in a few days to hook up a wide band to see how lean it really is and to see how much power it is making. Any bets on what dies first? power output? how many flamming responses i will get? I know it is sad to see a eco potentially die but it is a chance to get some good information on what eco's really can and cant take and how well the computer will deal with stuff that it just wasnt designed to do. I have also decided that i am not going to pull it until there is some kind of failure, Maybe this will help some people from hurting their engines or maybe it wont. Who knows.


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

i bet your tranny takes a @!#$ first.

I killed a differential at 60K so it got a used one with 15k on it. So the trans really only has 55k on it.


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

Judging by your posts I really want to say you have more money and time than intelligence. Why would you willingly kill an engine and a turbo setup that you could sell to fund the Northstar swap. But oh well. Not my money.

Wont to pay shipping costs? I no noone who needs any of this.


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

sorry for posting twice. I dont think you understand really what i want to accomplish. We all do our best to maintain and preserve our engines and no one ever really gets the chance to "just see what happens". Well i have to opportunity to do that so i am going to.


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

TheSundownFire (GME Chat) wrote:Judging by your posts I really want to say you have more money and time than intelligence. Why would you willingly kill an engine and a turbo setup that you could sell to fund the Northstar swap. But oh well. Not my money.

bingo. Hell if I had the extra cash I could use a spare Eco. Can't have enough parts.

Well it would be great for spare parts if i wasnt swaping the motor out for something completly different.


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

And i suppose i should probably add this , Im not TRYING to blow it up out beating on it mercilously low on oil riding it at red line, just not babying around with the setup up anymore. Just to see if the eco really is as strong as it would appear gm has designed it. Maybe it wont die how cool would that be?


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

I don't know what you are trying to prove. Skunk already made over 300whp on stock internals, and because you refuse to tune it...yeah, you are trying to blow it up.




I have no signiture

It is getting enough fuel to run just fine. No spark knock under load, no misfiring, no dips in power delivery. The magic word "tune" i keep hearing that "if you dont tune it it will self destruct". While hooked up to the scan tool i was watching it under boost and the long term fuel trim and short term fuel trim are compensating enough to allow the o2 sensor to switch from rich to lean. So I suppose if you want to know what im trying to prove it is that with a little bit of common sense and a bit of knowledge anything is possiable. Where can i find some info on what skunk did?


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

wtf.

Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

vid?

of what?


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

you blowing this engine up, i wanna see it, i'd also like to see this rear mount turbo set-up.

Im not going to drive it with a camera on everyday...


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

how bout pics of the rear mount turbo set-up then?

Sorry I dont have a smart phone so my resolution is crap and the size is small by small. Those are all the pics i have that have anything to do with the turbo.


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

Josh A wrote:It is getting enough fuel to run just fine. No spark knock under load, no misfiring, no dips in power delivery. The magic word "tune" i keep hearing that "if you dont tune it it will self destruct". While hooked up to the scan tool i was watching it under boost and the long term fuel trim and short term fuel trim are compensating enough to allow the o2 sensor to switch from rich to lean. So I suppose if you want to know what im trying to prove it is that with a little bit of common sense and a bit of knowledge anything is possiable. Where can i find some info on what skunk did?

I'll apologize in advance if what I'm about to say sounds condescending...

Your 02 sensor is a narrowband sensor. It tells you nothing more than whether you are rich, lean or stoich. Closed loop with a narrowbnd is only useful for emissions and fuel economy. It does nothing to help performance. There is a general range of known AFR's we tune to in order to make power and keep cylinder temps down to fight pre-ignition. Stoich (14.7:1) is horribly lean compared to the 12:1 or so that you should be tuning to under boost. This requires a wideband sensor. I'm going to make some generalizations, since your profile doesn't list these, but by running wastegate spring pressure without even as much as an FMU or larger injectors and no wideband or EGT to monitor your cylinders under boost, you are driving a time bomb... and you are therefore not accurately showing what a stock ECO is capable of. That's why I asked what you were trying to prove.

If you are curious of what Curtis did, you can search for posts he made. I'm too lazy to do it. His member name is xls2004




I have no signiture

I have to arguement for the fact that i am leaving power on the table by not diving in with hp tuners and a wideband but i dont want to spend that money on this setup it isnt worth it for me. But at 14.7 without any knock retard or audible ping i would not call it a time bomb, Just leaner than you would like to see. It is getting more fuel but it is not getting it through computer tuning, it is getting it through extra fuel pressure and the computers built in ability to make corrections which i monitored very carefully before and after i upped the boost and was able to see the change the computer applied. I put a bit of thought into what i was doing i didnt just hill billy it together and cross my fingers. It dosent really sound like you are being condescending because i dont think you have all the information about this that you need to understand what i have going on, which i appologize because that would be my fault.


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

damnit.. I have NO arguement is what that was supposed to say... do you ever see mistakes as you hit the post button?


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

go premi and you can edit your posts.

really? that would be nice


Remember... One test is worth a thousand expert opinions.

well i am all for what you are doin cause i would like to know what happens when you just say @!#$ it. so what is our AFR at WOT? and it is tuned for 5 psi right? why not tune it for the 12-15 psi and see how long it holds up under boost it wouldn't cost all the much if you tuned it already just go back to the same guy, a few street runs and it would be better then nothing then i would be really interested in the results. best of luck to you tho i wish i had a spare ld9 to try this out on except i would tune it and see how long it held up.