Well i got the car back today... and here are the numbers..
230whp @7psi (into the engine) from 4600rpm on up to 7000rpm
this is still with the 3" supercharger pulley on so i can easly bring that down and have the power band even steeper but as the guy tuning it said he tunes lots of turbo sport compacts and the boost comes on insainly fast so he isnt sure if i should go to a smaller pulley or not... i will try it and see how it goes...
so as far as i know most turbo only 2.4L with out any porting or such mods are making about the same hp @7psi so i was right with i wouldnt make any more power... but my power band is alot steeper... although some of you i already know will say no but doesnt really matter/effect me...
here is the dyno sheet i got... not the best... but he said it was hard to get a proper RPM signal from my car so the RPM isnt on there... ill will probably get it dynoed at a place here in town when i play around with the pulleys and will hopfully have a better sheet to post...
i will say though it pulls VERY! nice.. alot better then even i expected it to... pulls hard on the bottom end like when it was just supercharged but keeps that pull all that way untill i shift..
The First Twin Charged jbody
blue car (R.I.P) - 240whp @7psi..
silver car - 305whp 315lbs.tq @15psi (91 Octane) or 420whp & 425lbs.TQ @20psi (94 octane+Alcohol Injection)
All dynos run on a Mustang dyno
A round of applause man!!
I'm rooting for ya!
Continue on with great success.
>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----
thanks man... im just waiting for the 7 pages of "this is useless" or "wast of money" even though i would love to hear their reasons why
The First Twin Charged jbody
blue car (R.I.P) - 240whp @7psi..
silver car - 305whp 315lbs.tq @15psi (91 Octane) or 420whp & 425lbs.TQ @20psi (94 octane+Alcohol Injection)
All dynos run on a Mustang dyno
Don't listen to them, you are doing great and being unique while exploring a new territory us. With that in mind, I give you major props and hope it goes as you plan.
My main issues is all that power is going FWD... that gotta be a handful.
>>>For Sale? Clicky!<<<
-----The orginal Mr.Goodwrench on the JBO since 11/99-----
I do applaud the work Josh, you have a lot of ingenuity and pioneering in this area. I'm glad you went out and got some numbers.
I just don't see the return vs investment. I know you've heard the argument before, so I won't get into it too deep, but the numbers I'm seeing just don't look like anything a correctly sized turbo and a boost controller could do.
Anyway, good luck with the setup, hopefully you can squeeze some good numbers out of it.
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i forgot to add as well i had the guy change when my fans come on (not sure what its set to ) but it definaly helped out BIG time.. the car ran very cool today ... so no more heat problems... although the ultimate test will be in 2 weeks when it will be in saskatoon and sitting in trafic with +40 degree weather...
The First Twin Charged jbody
blue car (R.I.P) - 240whp @7psi..
silver car - 305whp 315lbs.tq @15psi (91 Octane) or 420whp & 425lbs.TQ @20psi (94 octane+Alcohol Injection)
All dynos run on a Mustang dyno
Shifted wrote:I do applaud the work Josh, you have a lot of ingenuity and pioneering in this area. I'm glad you went out and got some numbers.
I just don't see the return vs investment. I know you've heard the argument before, so I won't get into it too deep, but the numbers I'm seeing just don't look like anything a correctly sized turbo and a boost controller could do.
Anyway, good luck with the setup, hopefully you can squeeze some good numbers out of it.
My thoughts exactly. I'll give you props for the fact that you actually went out and did the twin-charged setup. However I cannot congradulate you on the numbers. Just too flat. With a setup like that I wouldn't expect less than 250HP. I made the same numbers on just a turbo though.
Sorry...just my HONEST .02. I ain't gonna lie to you and tell you your #1.
I used to race cars, now I race myself.
5K PB: 24:50
10K PB: 54:26
230 is limp dick hp numbers neat project, but like everyone said too much money for almost no return.
i wouldnt even have made a post if that was my car.
i do have a few questions for you that i'm kind of curious of.
1) what psi is the stock pulley on the charger?
2) where is the vacuum source for the wastegate on the turbo?
3) i know you mentioned it before in another thread but how do you figure out the total boost ?
7psi seems way out of the effiency range of a to4e 57 trim...looks like you need to build for boost and turn it up and put some real numbers down since i doubt your even touching what you could
once he ups the boost the charger will become the serious bottleneck, and his iat's will shoot through the roof. when it comes down to it, a 57 trim by itself would make 400whp.
Team Vision Racing (aka hypsy) wrote:Shifted wrote:I do applaud the work Josh, you have a lot of ingenuity and pioneering in this area. I'm glad you went out and got some numbers.
I just don't see the return vs investment. I know you've heard the argument before, so I won't get into it too deep, but the numbers I'm seeing just don't look like anything a correctly sized turbo and a boost controller could do.
Anyway, good luck with the setup, hopefully you can squeeze some good numbers out of it.
My thoughts exactly. I'll give you props for the fact that you actually went out and did the twin-charged setup. However I cannot congradulate you on the numbers. Just too flat. With a setup like that I wouldn't expect less than 250HP. I made the same numbers on just a turbo though.
Sorry...just my HONEST .02. I ain't gonna lie to you and tell you your #1.
250hp @7psi hey? show me some one who has made that on a other wise bone stock LD9 with 7psi... i can easly hit 250 with a turn of the boost controler...
ccfab wrote:230 is limp dick hp numbers neat project, but like everyone said too much money for almost no return.
i wouldnt even have made a post if that was my car.
"limp dick" what are you are you @!#$ 12?
Volumeking333(Ryan) wrote:i do have a few questions for you that i'm kind of curious of.
1) what psi is the stock pulley on the charger?
2) where is the vacuum source for the wastegate on the turbo?
3) i know you mentioned it before in another thread but how do you figure out the total boost ?
7psi seems way out of the effiency range of a to4e 57 trim...looks like you need to build for boost and turn it up and put some real numbers down since i doubt your even touching what you could
stock i got about 4psi with a 2.8" pulley (stock pulley) im running a 3.0" pulley rightnow
the waste gate is controled by what the engine sees
hooked into the same place the wastegate is..
yes 7psi is still out of the range of the t3/t04e 6o trim turbo i have... 10psi (into the engine) with a 3.0" and even 2.8" pulley puts it perfectly into the center of the turbo map
ccfab wrote:once he ups the boost the charger will become the serious bottleneck, and his iat's will shoot through the roof. when it comes down to it, a 57 trim by itself would make 400whp.
humm thats what you guys all said about it at any boost level and it doesnt seem to effect it like that right now... i dont see it being a problem, work it out your self and maybe understand how the supercharger works before you try and say @!#$ like this plus its a T3/T04E 60 trim ...
The First Twin Charged jbody
blue car (R.I.P) - 240whp @7psi..
silver car - 305whp 315lbs.tq @15psi (91 Octane) or 420whp & 425lbs.TQ @20psi (94 octane+Alcohol Injection)
All dynos run on a Mustang dyno
either way, i wouldnt brag about 230whp. of course its not a bottle neck now, but it will be,
maybe you would have done something differently if YOU knew how much that charger will cripple your power output once you start tying to make any kind of real power. this setup is a overpriced novelty, nothing more.
i would bet money your iat's are significantly higher than those of someone who is running just a turbo kit at the same boost level.
that will only be magnified once you start spinning the blower faster, ie smaller pulley. iats cripple power output, and raise your knock limit. have fun with that
so its a 60 trim, that means your good to 525whp on the turbo alone.
since when did he brag about it? ^^^^^^^
people have been asking for numbers.
Seriously. stop posting. all you ever do is spout crap and put everyone down.
Grow the hell up.
Nice job josh, might not be what you're expecting but you know what, that's some fine work there, it's more than I'd be able to put up with doing.
Josh F wrote:thanks man... im just waiting for the 7 pages of "this is useless" or "wast of money" even though i would love to hear their reasons why
no...i wanna see time slips
as for the numbers....they are pretty damn nice for 7psi...where you are going to see gains is the track
my only suggestion would be to get a electronic boost controller so you can up your boost in the higher gears
2007 GM Tuner Bash...HELL YEA
PA,MD,NJ,DE,NY and all states north caravan
Seems like a nice set for an otherwise stock car, I would like to know a little more on the way the SC is "wired" so it doesn't become a bottle neck.
Have you done the Alky injection on that car yet, I think that dropping the IAT would help out some in this case. An equally well prepared eco would be a nice project to see as that kit has the ability t be aftercooled.
Keep it up and keep us appriased, the hters will be htere no matter what you do.
Nari (Rod) wrote:since when did he brag about it? ^^^^^^^
people have been asking for numbers.
Seriously. stop posting. all you ever do is spout crap and put everyone down.
Grow the hell up.
Nice job josh, might not be what you're expecting but you know what, that's some fine work there, it's more than I'd be able to put up with doing.
you think that because you guys all live in your little happy land loaded with people who have zero clue what they are talking about and @!#$loads of misinformation. i just tell you how it is. im sorry it twists your tits.
Glad to hear you have it running well, what are the IAT's under full boost (in 3rd gear so it's had a chance to get hot)? I think what alot of people are missing is that this is the 1st level tune, on a stock engine (that's the limiting factor here). Without a built motor, there's no room to make more power, what's the best anyone's seen on a stock 2.4 so far? Not much more than this I'll bet.
15.3 @ 89.97mph, 14's on the way?
Gald to see you throw up some numbers from your setup. Who cares what everyone says, it hadn't been done before and you did it. Sure it might not have been what everyone was looking for or what you were expecting but who cares, thats how we all learn as a whole. If I would of listened to all the people who said it can't be done, waste of money, tranny won't hold up, it's only a cavalier, blah, blah, blah I wouldn't be driving a 12 second j-body everyday.
Keep at it, who knows maybe after some experimenting with different pullies and such you might just impress the non-believers and if not again who cares, you have something no one else has and have helped the community as a whole.
Quoth the Raven 'Nevermore
raven@accesswave.ca
Raven Autosports
55 McQuade Lake Cres,
Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
(902) 850-3330
10.82@132
ccfab wrote:Nari (Rod) wrote:since when did he brag about it? ^^^^^^^
people have been asking for numbers.
Seriously. stop posting. all you ever do is spout crap and put everyone down.
Grow the hell up.
Nice job josh, might not be what you're expecting but you know what, that's some fine work there, it's more than I'd be able to put up with doing.
you think that because you guys all live in your little happy land loaded with people who have zero clue what they are talking about and @!#$loads of misinformation. i just tell you how it is. im sorry it twists your tits.
Mind if i ask what your accomplishments on this motor are?
i choose not to waste my time with the americanzer mobiles.
but if i did i can assure you it would be no less than 400whp .
mind if i ask what your accomplishments are? there mr sarcasm face?
ccfab wrote:i choose not to waste my time with the americanzer mobiles.
but if i did i can assure you it would be no less than 400whp .
mind if i ask what your accomplishments are? there mr sarcasm face?
Oh good one what are you 12? Somehow i knew you would ask what my accomplishments were, with this engine, nothing, i dont build them, but the thing is im not ragging on him, so i have nothing to prove.
Shifted ban me if you want, i dont care anymore, im so sick of people ragging on josh for what he didnt. He doesnt @!#$ deserve it. He did a good job, and he did something other people havnt done.
ccfab wrote:i choose not to waste my time with the americanzer mobiles.
but if i did i can assure you it would be no less than 400whp .
mind if i ask what your accomplishments are? there mr sarcasm face?
I find it interesting that you are going too get something that most people here plan on as a max, though you know nothing about the engine, the configuration, etc. What are you intentions here except to stir the pot, this is the second thread in this forum you have brought down.
Josh has done something interesting that most people only consider with the imports, and most people only consider as a passing fancy. Can this be done with just a turbo and boost controller yes, but it could also be done with just a variable vane turbo, but no one has brought that up yet either, oh wait thats because the technology is so limited in application and is designed for much larger engines.
I am actually considering this with the eco sc and a turbo as well, why because it is different and is something no one would consider. is it the most efficient, probably not, but it is a unique application and offers people another way to make power. I am impressed with what he has done, and consider it an honor to see the innovation on this car.
And as for balancing the IAT, a little alky injection, as I mentioned earlier, would possibly help that with the 2.4, but with the eco the aftercooler could be configured to assist greatly Josh best of luck and keep us appraised.
Ban me if you must, but take down the instigator at the same time.....
