I am getting a whole lot of KR under boost.. I see 6 almost all the time under boost... sometimes I even get a misfire flashing CEL... I have TR7's gapped at 27 thou, and I run premium, sometimes with octane boost. GM has max KR set at 6 degree's, but I turned the mas up to 10, and it hits that without even thinking. The car just completely falls on it's face when this happens..

I have good FP, 255 pump, 650 injectors, MY wideband show 12:1 when it sees all this KR, and I just can't think of anything else to try... seems like it might be in need of a better spark.. anyone?

I run 8.5:1 wiseco, with cometic 0.36 HG(to raise compression to about 8.9:1), 11psi through a T3 turbo, and secret cams. Is it possible I see this from the 2.3 oil pump swap, or stiffer motor mounts, or a combo of all the above? The engine is fully balanced 2.4 LD9.


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

More spark will not get rid of a misfire or knock retard

First off change your plugs to rapidfire #5s those seem to work good with 2.4s, and run a little more gap if your running an msd

Why would you turn up the knock retard? Im assuming you did this in HP tuners put it back to where it was stock no need to mess with that section

You might want to try lowering the AFR a little I noticed I have no knock at all when i stay below 12.2, the higher I go the more knock i get, just cause its a wideband dont mean its dead on, you may in fact be alot higher than 12.0 AFR

Motor mounts will not peg your knock sensor and the flashing cel is usually caused by a lean condition, at least it was for me



1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85

I am running stock ignition now, I am curious if MSD would help me with my Misfire stuff, but sounds like no

I have NGK tr-7 they are 2 steps colder, I heard they were really good for the 2.4, I can try some rapidfires

I just turned up the max to see if it was stopping at 6 by itseld or cause that was the max... appears that was the just the max... it would go higher if it could.

I guess I could try turning it down to the 11.7 mark or something and see if that makes a difference, I know if you run alittle richer, in theory you can run more agressive timing.

Yes I used the HPtuners, to screw with stuff. First off I thought it might be my 310cc injectors, so I went 650's just to make sure that was not the issue...

If my exhuast was restrictive would this cause and issue like this? What kind of HP numbers have you seen on stock ignition?


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

What are you running for timing Garrett? Have you tried pulling timing to see if it lessens KR? What grade fuel? Your exhaust MAY be causing issues due to too much backpressure, when are you getting it redone?


15.3 @ 89.97mph, 14's on the way?

A few things you may want to think about....

Have you ever calculated where you are in the effeciency island of your t3? If your way out of the island you are going to be getting some high egts and knock. As well do you think that the car falling on its face in the high rpms might be you running out of turbo?

Another thing is your exhaust, is it big? Like 3"? or are you on the stock cat back? If your on the stock cat back thats a problem.

You may want to think of a thermostat so that your call is cooling itself earlier..... less heat = less Kr.

After all this, then you should pull timing or raise the octane of your fuel. There is a gas additive called Toluene that you may want to look into.

The later is AFTER you have eliminated all the mechanical restrictions that are boosing your KR.




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Garrett has used up all his post for this month, but he told me lastnight that he is running GMSC timing (unchanged), premium fuel (91), and will be getting his exhaust done when he gets back from work in a few weeks.

Hopefully the exhaust fixes the KR issues he's having. Anyone else have any ideas for him?


15.3 @ 89.97mph, 14's on the way?

wasnt there a thread a while back that said something about putting teflon tape around the sensor to help 'soften' it up a bit.? It also talked about about adding a restrictor to it to basically disable the sensor completly
I know this isn't smart to do in garretts case cause detonation would own him. I only brought that up cause someone addressed an issue like this in that same post (i believe)

oh, and about the exhaust thing. My n/a 2.4 had a CloggeD! cat on that sucker and I could feel the timing being pulled. Fixed my cat and the car ran great.

Toluene will destroy your fuel system. do not use it. it is used as a paint thinner and doesnt get along with the plastic lines in your fuel system

^^^ that sounds like something I have read before. I know some people who have used it, but I am not sure I would put it in my tank. I put the larger exhaust system on, and I still get all the same KR as before, but the power loss is gone... I guess the stock exhaust that has been really badly abused and bent (low car into the garage....) really was restrictive. Now with no power loss issues, and free flowing exhaust, I can safely say, ""fake kr" but still pisses me off, hmmmm


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

Well that's some good news, if you have some time to help me get my tranny ready to swap, I'll help you try and pinpoint that KR. I should be free any night this week for that, when do you go back to work, or are you already gone?


15.3 @ 89.97mph, 14's on the way?

I will be in winnipeg on tuesday, and I have a course on wednesday 5-10 pm, and friday 5-10pm... what are you doing after 10pm friday night?


HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED

hey man

good luck with your issue and the KR......i had the same issue myself and i was running a MSD DIS2 ignition setup but that CANNOT delete knock retard under boost. another thing to remember with your setup is that you are running forged internals "especially the pistons in this case" that can create enough noise for a stock knock sensor to trigger and take timing out under a good engine load. i also see that you are running HP tuners in your setup which i hear is an awesome system for the price. i am not sure if it offers the ability to completely eliminate knock retard under boost like my AEM standalone does? this is one of the many awesome options the AEM offers but then again thats why you pay what you do for it. anywhooo, there has been talk before on the forum abuout installing a resistor inline with the stock knock sensor to make it less sensitive under engine load. check the forum about the resistor trick, i know that it has been done and not only with jbodys so it must work. i never tried it because i ended up going with the turbo and the AEM on my cavy this sumer. basically you have the resistor option or checking into what your HP Tuners offers....good luck man.

I can turn down the MAX KR, so I can make it see max 3 degrees or 2 or w/e but I am not totally sure if I can disable it... I have been enjoying driving the car for now, I really love it ... but I do need to fix this issue this fall for sure. I was going through some pics, and some poeple have seen this one, but I really like it, so I will post it again




HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED