Hi all:

I have a 99 Sunfire GT Convertible. On Monday, as I was attempting to start the car to drive home from work, the key wouldn't turn all the way in order to start the car, got stuck at acc with all the lights on the cluster but nothing further. I called AAA and they told me that the battery was ok and thought it had something to do with the ignition. So I had it towed to a shop nearby with good Yelp reviews to have them look at it. The guy there just called me now and said that it requires some kind of reprogramming and that I would have to have it towed to a dealer in order to get that done. He says that he can get it started, but it then the engine shuts down after about 2 minutes.

I don't have keyless remotes, its just a regular key. Of course there are no dealers nearby anymore since Pontiac shut down, so before i get it towed again to somewhere else that might rip me off, I thought I'd ask you guys about it. About 2 years ago, I lost my keys and had an auto locksmith dude replace my ignition key, but thats the extent of anything I've done to the car, other than replace the stereo (twice now )

What is he talking about? Is this some kind of theft deterrent built in? What kind of reprogramming does it need? Do I really have to go to a dealer? How much should it cost me?

Thanks...Chris

There is a relearn procedure you can do urself. Go to this post CLICKY FOR RELEARN And it will tell you exactly what to do to relearn ur key. Im willing to bet that somethign was wrong with ur tumbler. Either way, if he disconnected the tumbler, you need to relearn the theft system. Its easy and should take u about 10 mins if you do it right the first time. You do not need to take it to a dealer. Go to the car, if he is able to get the car started, pay him, do the relearn, show him he is a idiot, and go home! Goodluck!

The J-Body never had a "PassKey" (PassKey is GM's factory anti-theft system, usually indicated by a PK2 or PK3 on the key, prior systems had an obvious "pill" in the key) system in it. There should be no reason to "reprogram" the keys or the ignition switch. It is a common ignition switch that you should be able to pick up at any auto parts store and replace. There should be only 1 wire going to the tumbler and that is for the reminder that indicates there is a key in the ignition when you go to exit the vehicle. But as far as a reprogram or a theft system is concerned, unless someone installed an aftermarket anti-theft system in the vehicle, there should be no reason that an issue with the key should cause the vehicle to stall or not run unless the key just doesn't turn the tumbler. I recently lost the only key and key-fob I had to my 02 Cav and just went to the dealership with proof of ownership and the vin number and they cut me a new key. I went home, stuck it in the ignition and started the car. I have since had 2 extras cut at the hardware store and have used all of them at least once with no issues, no programming, and no stalling. In 2005, I had a new key cut off the vin of my 99 Z24 at a local dealership to have for a back-up when I drove it on vacation. I used that key later in 2006 without any issues, programming, or stalling. To me your issues sound like a PCM or an ignition module type issue. I would recommend checking all of your grounds and making sure they are all clean and tight, then go from there. I would also check and see if your vehicle had the PCM recall completed. In late 99 or sometime in 00, there was a recall that came out listing symptoms similar to yours that had the technician remove the PCM, opening it up and checking the board for corrosion, and if good resealing it with silicone and then putting a rubber bag over it to protect it from road salt and debris as well as excessive moisture. I do not know if that recall is still in effect, but it wouldn't hurt to call a local GM dealership and ask.



Some people have brain storms, others light drizzles. And then there are those that have droughts.

JCZ Z24 wrote:The J-Body never had a "PassKey" (PassKey is GM's factory anti-theft system, usually indicated by a PK2 or PK3 on the key, prior systems had an obvious "pill" in the key) system in it. There should be no reason to "reprogram" the keys or the ignition switch. It is a common ignition switch that you should be able to pick up at any auto parts store and replace. There should be only 1 wire going to the tumbler and that is for the reminder that indicates there is a key in the ignition when you go to exit the vehicle. But as far as a reprogram or a theft system is concerned, unless someone installed an aftermarket anti-theft system in the vehicle, there should be no reason that an issue with the key should cause the vehicle to stall or not run unless the key just doesn't turn the tumbler. I recently lost the only key and key-fob I had to my 02 Cav and just went to the dealership with proof of ownership and the vin number and they cut me a new key. I went home, stuck it in the ignition and started the car. I have since had 2 extras cut at the hardware store and have used all of them at least once with no issues, no programming, and no stalling. In 2005, I had a new key cut off the vin of my 99 Z24 at a local dealership to have for a back-up when I drove it on vacation. I used that key later in 2006 without any issues, programming, or stalling. To me your issues sound like a PCM or an ignition module type issue. I would recommend checking all of your grounds and making sure they are all clean and tight, then go from there. I would also check and see if your vehicle had the PCM recall completed. In late 99 or sometime in 00, there was a recall that came out listing symptoms similar to yours that had the technician remove the PCM, opening it up and checking the board for corrosion, and if good resealing it with silicone and then putting a rubber bag over it to protect it from road salt and debris as well as excessive moisture. I do not know if that recall is still in effect, but it wouldn't hurt to call a local GM dealership and ask.

Altho not wrong, ur not 100% correct. All the newer jbodies come with a theft lock system. It needs relearning anytime u mess with the tumbler, or the cluster (in the 00+) and so on. I know for a fact if u disconnect the tumbler, you need to do a relearn of the theft lock. Even tho there is no "Pill" as you called it, doesnt mean there isnt a reason for the car to learn the key. Im not sure of the technicals of it. But I replaced the tumbler in a 02 and it would not start and needed to relearn the theft lock. Y im not sure. But it would run for a few seconds, stall, and the theft lock light was flashing, so I knew it would need to do a relearn. This guys problem is describing it 100% to a T that he needs a relearn. When you have new keys cut, you dont need to relarn anything. Anytime you have a key cut, it dont need it to be relearned. I never said that. IF the tumbler (which is what he had a issue with) for any reason has a problem, and gets disconnected, the theft lock needs to be relearned once its reconnected or the car will run and stall and the theft system light will flash, meaning that the theft system has been triggered and thinks ur trying to steel the car, thus causing the cars engine to turn off. Im willing to bet he needs to do the few min relearn and call it a day.

OK, that is a new one to me. I worked in a few different Chevrolet dealerships between 1997 and 2004, and never had I seen an issue. In fact, when I questioned it on my 99, I found out it doesn't have the PassKey system. The older pill style keys were OBD1. The newer PassKey systems use a chip that triggers a hall-effect sensor in the ignition tumbler. I am currently having problems with that on my 05 Uplander. Most of the time it triggers the theft light on my wife's key and only her's, however from time to time, it will trigger on my key and the third key I have in my stable of spare vehicle keys. But even with that, it never prevents me from driving the vehicle. But back to his concern on his J-Body. The Cav nor the Sunfire have hall-effect switches. The only thing I could think of with what you're describing is the tumbler itself is wired so that if it is removed, the vehicle will not start. If I understand you correctly, then I've learned something. If I don't understand correctly, I will investigate this some more and educate myself, maybe with some more isight from you.



Some people have brain storms, others light drizzles. And then there are those that have droughts.

Well, Im not trying to say your wrong. The J bodies in fact do not have a pass key system of any type. But for whatever reason, if the tumbler (and in some cases i have seen the ignition switch itself) become disconnected, the theft system needs to relearn the car. Why that is I have no idea. But what he is describing sounds like the theft deterrent has been triggered, and needs to be relearned/reprogrammed. What exactly is does im not 100% sure. I too have worked at a couple chevy dealers, and when the cars came in (J Bodies in this case) that had a issue with starting fine, running fine, then out of nowhere shutting down after a min or two, the theft system light will be flashing, and they would do a theft system relearn and the car would be fine from then on out. Sometimes this also happens if the car has sat for a very very long time with a dead battery. Again, My friends 02 Ls Sport w/ eco that we replaced was having issues with the tumbler. After we reinstalled the new tumbler, the car would run, then shut off after a min or two. We did the relearn on the theft system (which for 00+ takes about 30 mins if done right the 1st time, and on 95-99 takes all of about 10-15 min to complete) the car started right up, and had no more issues. Again, im not sure what triggers this, but I know in the 00+ if you remove the cluster, you need to do this, and im not sure about the 95-99, and again, I know if the tumbler has been removed for whatever reason it needs to be done again. This is only personal experience. So Im not here to call you out or anything, but u are correct on the keys not having anykind of pass-lock system inside it. But for some reason, the tumblers and cluster have it wired in and need to be relearned for the PCM coding or something along those lines (thats what I have been told). I know the actual tumber has two wires, IIRC one yellow and one brown-or-black (I cant remember) so maybe that has something to do with it, again, im not sure.

J-body cars have Passlock. There's a blurb in the FAQ about it... go read

I've never had an issue with disconnecting the wires and reconnecting the same parts... but if you have to change part of the system (cluster, ignition cylinder, PCM, etc) then you do have to perform the re-learn procedure (also listed in the FAQ)