Ok, what GM throttle bodies, bigger then ecotecs factory 56mm use the same sensors as us? same tps and iac sensor?
If you can post the vehicle type, and size of TB that'd be great, I am looking for something 70mm
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You know what...I'd like to know this as well...listening...
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OLD THREAD RESURRECTION ALERT!!!!
I am looking at a complete new intake for my 05 fire, is there a bolt on OEM larger throttle body that I can use? What about getting the 2.4 LE5 manifold and tb off of a solstice or ion? I don't have any boost plans just trying to build a budget n/a motor.
-I drive my car to work-
durandall05 . wrote:OLD THREAD RESURRECTION ALERT!!!!
I am looking at a complete new intake for my 05 fire, is there a bolt on OEM larger throttle body that I can use? What about getting the 2.4 LE5 manifold and tb off of a solstice or ion? I don't have any boost plans just trying to build a budget n/a motor.
Le5 and ion TBs won't work, they are electronic controlled. You need to use a cable driven. LS1 tb's are an easy choice, the iac is plug and play, and the tps just needs an adapter harness (or repinning)
I wouldnt use an LSx tb on just a mild n/a setup, plus it would be more trouble mating it to a stock/le5 intake mani.
Why cant the eco be simple like quads, $20 at the junkyard and you got a 4mm bigger tb pretty much drops right in
or just get a TB and make an adapter most GM use the same sensors
JBO since July 30, 2001
Bleh thanks for the info. I read that in 05 the Ion changed to DBW but that was because they added the LE5... I don't want a LSx TB to big for what I have planned but a slightly larger one would be nice, I guess I am going to start looking at other options and a custom adapter.
-I drive my car to work-
can you use a lsj throttle body off the super charger with no problems?
gilligan
if i plan on using the le5 intake manifold which larger throttle body could bolt onto that with the sensors being able to match up
gilligan
Give it up.....no.
We cannot use drive by wire.
so the only throttle body we can use on the 2.4 is our stock one? and last question what about the ones in the ecotec write up guide that is stickied like the rsm or the reveco? promise last questions because i want the 2.4l manifold and a larger throttle body.
gilligan
A bigger throttle body on all but the most wild NA setups isnt going to make a difference anyways. Hell a lot of the boosted setups on here wouldnt benefit from one either.
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Leafy (Club Jeffie FEA man) wrote:A bigger throttle body on all but the most wild NA setups isnt going to make a difference anyways. Hell a lot of the boosted setups on here wouldnt benefit from one either.
12.4@115 on the stock intake mani and throttle body...
@!#$ i aint wasting my money then thanks guys
gilligan
Sheridan wrote:@!#$ i aint wasting my money then thanks guys
A larger Tb is a great mod. Do not listen to Leafy he is a dumb ass.
FU Tuning
Addicted to meth wrote:Sheridan wrote:@!#$ i aint wasting my money then thanks guys
A larger Tb is a great mod. Do not listen to Leafy he is a dumb ass.
Let me write this in a "non Master ASE style"..... But Leafy knows everything....... He is right no matter what..... Real world experience and does not mean anything, because he is simply the worlds smartest badd@ss..... Remember, he has tuned a total of maybe 3 cars...... I would love to be able to do that..... 3 cars.... WoW... I am super jeolous of his allmighty knowledge... When I grow up, I want to be just like him.....
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
Addicted to meth wrote:Sheridan wrote:@!#$ i aint wasting my money then thanks guys
A larger Tb is a great mod. Do not listen to Leafy he is a dumb ass.
Are you really saying that going to, in this case, huge, throttle body in an NA app is good? That 75mm throttle body is considered non-restrictive for most bolt on builds on the 5.7 litre engine that it comes on stock. At near stock power level a bigger throttle body is not worth the money. You see minimal WOT throttle gains, and your butt dyno says it makes huge gains because you flow significantly more air at partial throttle. ALSO since our fueling is done based on throttle position I would be very worried about running lean at partial throttle if you did not get a tune.
Furthermore, based on conventional math an approximately 50mm throttle body is a good starting point for designing a throttle body for your power levels, going slightly larger will increase top end power slightly while increasing throttle response, however going too large will essentially provide you with WOT airflow at less than WOT. If you were going with a more aggressive na build with cams and shooting for a higher horsepower number, best practice indicate that a throttle body in the 57 to 62mm range would work best.
Its funny that this thread go brought up again, I just finished designing generation 2 of my barrel throttle body for the racecar last night, based on the lessons learned for the first generation that I designed and machined.
1994 Saturn SL2 Home Coming Edition: backup car
2002 Chevy Cavalier LS Sport Coupe: In a Junk Yard
1995 Mazda Miata R-package Class=STR
Sponsored by:
Kronos Performance
WPI Class of '12 Mechanical Engineering
WPI SAE Risk and Sustainability Management Officer
Leafy (Club Jeffie FEA man) wrote:Addicted to meth wrote:Sheridan wrote:@!#$ i aint wasting my money then thanks guys
A larger Tb is a great mod. Do not listen to Leafy he is a dumb ass.
Are you really saying that going to, in this case, huge, throttle body in an NA app is good? That 75mm throttle body is considered non-restrictive for most bolt on builds on the 5.7 litre engine that it comes on stock. At near stock power level a bigger throttle body is not worth the money. You see minimal WOT throttle gains, and your butt dyno says it makes huge gains because you flow significantly more air at partial throttle. ALSO since our fueling is done based on throttle position I would be very worried about running lean at partial throttle if you did not get a tune.
Furthermore, based on conventional math an approximately 50mm throttle body is a good starting point for designing a throttle body for your power levels, going slightly larger will increase top end power slightly while increasing throttle response, however going too large will essentially provide you with WOT airflow at less than WOT. If you were going with a more aggressive na build with cams and shooting for a higher horsepower number, best practice indicate that a throttle body in the 57 to 62mm range would work best.
Its funny that this thread go brought up again, I just finished designing generation 2 of my barrel throttle body for the racecar last night, based on the lessons learned for the first generation that I designed and machined.
I never said a 75mm. I just simply a larger one. If you were to research years back I hafe always said you can go too larger on a N/A. Still does not change that a larger one on a stock motor would not help.
Also if you research back I have also said tuning after any mod is a good thing.
Still at partial throttle AFR's will be controlled by the ECU and O2 sensor. So yes it wold be lean because that is what the ECU is aiming for (14.6). For partial throttle this is more than acceptable.
FU Tuning
Addicted to meth wrote:Leafy (Club Jeffie FEA man) wrote:Addicted to meth wrote:Sheridan wrote:@!#$ i aint wasting my money then thanks guys
A larger Tb is a great mod. Do not listen to Leafy he is a dumb ass.
Are you really saying that going to, in this case, huge, throttle body in an NA app is good? That 75mm throttle body is considered non-restrictive for most bolt on builds on the 5.7 litre engine that it comes on stock. At near stock power level a bigger throttle body is not worth the money. You see minimal WOT throttle gains, and your butt dyno says it makes huge gains because you flow significantly more air at partial throttle. ALSO since our fueling is done based on throttle position I would be very worried about running lean at partial throttle if you did not get a tune.
Furthermore, based on conventional math an approximately 50mm throttle body is a good starting point for designing a throttle body for your power levels, going slightly larger will increase top end power slightly while increasing throttle response, however going too large will essentially provide you with WOT airflow at less than WOT. If you were going with a more aggressive na build with cams and shooting for a higher horsepower number, best practice indicate that a throttle body in the 57 to 62mm range would work best.
Its funny that this thread go brought up again, I just finished designing generation 2 of my barrel throttle body for the racecar last night, based on the lessons learned for the first generation that I designed and machined.
I never said a 75mm. I just simply a larger one. If you were to research years back I hafe always said you can go too larger on a N/A. Still does not change that a larger one on a stock motor would not help.
Also if you research back I have also said tuning after any mod is a good thing.
Still at partial throttle AFR's will be controlled by the ECU and O2 sensor. So yes it wold be lean because that is what the ECU is aiming for (14.6). For partial throttle this is more than acceptable.
Even if that partial throttle is giving you the same airflow that you originally had at WOT with the stock throttle body? No you need to adjust your PE enable and higher % throttle fuel maps at least. With a larger TB you are giving the engine load that it does not recognize that it is getting.
While you may have not been saying 75mm, it was disused (and the op himself shot it down). I also ran the math on tb size for someone looking to make more wild amounts of HP while na. A goal of 175hp woul warrant a 57-62mm throttle body. After using a more complex calculator it does show that 57mm is optimal for a bolt on eco (or ln2) that wants peak power to happen at 6000 rpm. Where as anything over 89mm and you basically make your throttle into an on/off switch.
Here is that calculator by the way
dia rally TB calculator Little blurb at the top is good for this discussion (more towards the people who suggested he used the ls1 tb) "so you can justify your impulse to put the biggest mother on you can find even if the full throttling range is really about 20% of the pedal range?"
1994 Saturn SL2 Home Coming Edition: backup car
2002 Chevy Cavalier LS Sport Coupe: In a Junk Yard
1995 Mazda Miata R-package Class=STR
Sponsored by:
Kronos Performance
WPI Class of '12 Mechanical Engineering
WPI SAE Risk and Sustainability Management Officer
