Well I called about 10 injector places and finally was out browsing LS1 tech and it just so happens that i gave the one injector company a call that was on there and made great progress. Talked to a guy who has been doing it for 32 years and put injectors in places they should never have even been haha. so i am pretty confident he knows his stuff. so to the good stuff.
PJ posted this info for injectors...
2002 L61 injectors/ LSJ injectors:
overall injector length: 2.871" -or- 72.9mm
center o-ring to center o-ring: 2.494" -or- 63.3mm
2003-2005 L61 injectors:
overall injector length: 3.124" -or- 79.3mm
center o-ring to center o-ring: 2.653" -or- 67.3mm
smallest aftermarket injector I'd use with a J-body 03-05 rail:
bosch (color) top injectors:
overall injector length: 3.041" -or- 77.2mm
center o-ring to center o-ring: 2.579" -or- 65.5mm
which is correct.
i mentioned to him that i needed 67.3mm o-ring to o-ring and cant find them long enough. he said we have stupid injectors and that they are a small size BUT he sells the length adaptors for them.
http://fuelinjectorconnection.com/shop/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=212
which still doesnt make them long enough but just barely. so he is going to put another o-ring inside of the adaptor to space it out enough to make them the correct length.
and since i have an EV1 harness and these are "EV14" i had to get this adapter. going to be super plug and play.
http://fuelinjectorconnection.com/shop/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=23
and these are the injectors i went with. and if they are not big enough he said he has the ability to safely make them larger injectors and flow match them yet again. so basically these should/could be the last injectors i ever buy....
http://fuelinjectorconnection.com/shop/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=195
pic of my injector with o-ring in and adaptor on top compared to a stock injector.
only problem is you have to bottom the bottom of the injector to hold it in 1 place , since you lost the slip that holds it at the top
i had paco loco make me up some spacers like that along time ago for my 2.4
[quote=97cavie24ls(™)]only problem is you have to bottom the bottom of the injector to hold it in 1 place , since you lost the slip that holds it at the top
i had paco loco make me up some spacers like that along time ago for my 2.4
the fuel rail bolted to the head is what holds it in so it cant slide out. i assume you mean you lose the clip? i asked him about that and i made the point too, if you go to pull your injector out of your rail, it doesnt just fall out on its own. you literally have to pull it out because the o-rings have it sealed and stuck in there. the clips are not needed. he told me the fuel pressures and what not and that since the injectors are angled in at a degree, and that our rails mount to the head vertically then there is no way for it to kick out. i agree with him.
i think thats what you meant, that was hard to read.
Hmm, may have to look into these when my rc 650's are enough! My rail is slotted to fit shorter injectors(like lsj height) so fitment wont be an issue, and those are cheap as hell! Oh and I havnt used injector clips since I first started with lsj injectors when I was sc'd, still using ford greentops currently.
Good info!
Those will work with spacer like you said and the seimens deka 60lb and 80lb would be a direct drop in with 03 eco rail.I know for a fact since im running the 60lbers.
im lost. rc engineering couldnt handle the job??
We have used
these guys for a few years now. Same great service you described and good prices.
Ricardo Rosario wrote:Those will work with spacer like you said and the seimens deka 60lb and 80lb would be a direct drop in with 03 eco rail.I know for a fact since im running the 60lbers.
yeah i decided this route because i know a bunch of guys that just ordered off him on LS1tech and said he knew his stuff and he really showed it too. great guy to deal with.
z yaaaa wrote:im lost. rc engineering couldnt handle the job??
highest they go is 750cc @ $98.75 (bosch style)
mine are 850cc @ $65
so i basically saved $120 and he actually put one together for me and measured it out too. and rc didnt list much about each injector, now im sure had they called me back i would have got all the info, but like i said, this guy was a great transaction. plus it worked out to be a one stop shop. he had everything on hand all on his site and didnt have to jump to different sites for spacers, or harness or anything. i highly recommend this guy.
and the guy was very helpful, still never got a call back from rc. as well as this guy will do the same things rc will and even port these if they dont flow enough, which im sure they will be overkill for what i need but always nice to have spare room.
Cody @ RD Fabs wrote:We have used these guys for a few years now. Same great service you described and good prices.
called them too, actually never got a call back from them. maybe they will call tomorrow?
although i can certainly see why you would rather go with someone who actually contacts you back, the idea of needing a spacer just makes the idea seem un-professional to me. if it works, great... there is more than one way to skin a cat.
i would pay the extra to not have to deal with a spacer. but thats just me.
rc only goes up to 750cc's??? i could have sworn ive seen 1000 cc's or higher from them before.... maybe a different style, idk.
I almost bought a couple thousand of those injectors too...they came from Chrysler applications, and got dumped on the market cheap last year. I could have had them for $10 apiece if I committed to a large lot. Looks like someone snapped them up!
Fact is...any standard injector will fit the Eco, without spacers. All one has to do is change out the electrical connector. Easy, cheap, and then you can use any of the many sizes available.
Bill Hahn Jr.
Hahn RaceCraft
World's Quickest and Fastest Street J-Bodies
Turbocharging GM FWD's since 1988
www.turbosystem.com
z yaaaa wrote:although i can certainly see why you would rather go with someone who actually contacts you back, the idea of needing a spacer just makes the idea seem un-professional to me. if it works, great... there is more than one way to skin a cat.
i would pay the extra to not have to deal with a spacer. but thats just me.
rc only goes up to 750cc's??? i could have sworn ive seen 1000 cc's or higher from them before.... maybe a different style, idk.
i dont see how running a spacer is unprofessional. if thats true what about all the phenolic spacers? or tb spacers people use for spray? unprofessional or necessary?
exactly like you said, more than one way to skin a cat, This just gives people the option to run a 48mm injector and widen our options as well as parts availability.
the spacer wont hurt a thing, its on the intake side of the injector so it will have no affect what so ever, and once its in, its in. never have to mess with it and the fuel rail will have it pulled tight.
and rc does 750's then skips to 1000s. i needed in between there. 650's MIGHT have been enough but i wanted some breathing room. 1000s are way too big for me so no point trying to way underflow my injectors. it would be like getting a GT45R for my car and trying to run 5psi off it. this way if i come close to maxing out my 850's, then he said he can bore them bigger to fit my needs. also having his continued support is nice.
Bill Hahn Jr. wrote:I almost bought a couple thousand of those injectors too...they came from Chrysler applications, and got dumped on the market cheap last year. I could have had them for $10 apiece if I committed to a large lot. Looks like someone snapped them up!
Fact is...any standard injector will fit the Eco, without spacers. All one has to do is change out the electrical connector. Easy, cheap, and then you can use any of the many sizes available.
what length is the "standard injector" ? these are 48mm and i based my length off of what pj measured above for what i needed.
and he told me he did buy over 1000 injectors in a shot but he mentioned gm instead of chrysler. the guy was very cool and helpful. i recommend them to anyone.
running a phenolic spacer is different, unless its one to make the intake manifold match to the head when it does not. the phenolic spacers are meant to dissipate heat more, so.. they actually do serve a helpful purpose.
and it was just my opinion on the spacers for the injectors. they get the job done, i just wouldnt personally do that is all.
but i understand wanting to save money, so props on doing what you set out to do. and props for finding another option for you guys, that is always a plus.
and not to argue with you but read what you said....
z yaaaa wrote:running a phenolic spacer is different, unless its one to make the intake manifold match to the head when it does not. the phenolic spacers are meant to dissipate heat more, so.. they actually do serve a helpful purpose.
you said those spacers serve a purpose... do the injector spacers not serve a purpose? again not arguing just saying.
z yaaaa wrote:but i understand wanting to save money, so props on doing what you set out to do. and props for finding another option for you guys, that is always a plus.
and i figured all said and done, out the door. i saved enough to buy a whole injector, plus some. and yes, having as many options as possible is a very good thing. i just know sometimes its hard to find a high impedance injector. low impedance are dime a dozen.
Bill Hahn Jr. wrote:BuiltNBoosted wrote:z yaaaa wrote:Bill Hahn Jr. wrote:I almost bought a couple thousand of those injectors too...they came from Chrysler applications, and got dumped on the market cheap last year. I could have had them for $10 apiece if I committed to a large lot. Looks like someone snapped them up!
Fact is...any standard injector will fit the Eco, without spacers. All one has to do is change out the electrical connector. Easy, cheap, and then you can use any of the many sizes available.
what length is the "standard injector" ? these are 48mm and i based my length off of what pj measured above for what i needed.
and he told me he did buy over 1000 injectors in a shot but he mentioned gm instead of chrysler. the guy was very cool and helpful. i recommend them to anyone.
The same unit that was used for eons in domestic applications...V6, V8, Mustang, Camaro...they all fit.
I don't have one handy to measure, but these are the most common type available. Bosch, ACCEL, Motronic, you name it, everyone makes them. Just a connector change and they are in. Been doing it since Ecotec came here in 2003. Had I been aware you were looking, I'd have told you sooner.
Yes, I think those are from a Chrysler V8 applicaiton. Seems they were massively overproduced; hence the dumping on the market.
yeah the ones i picked up are actually LS1/2/6/7 injectors. and these are only 48mm 0-ring to o-ring. which we need 67.3mm. i just had to get the spacers to make them fit plus an extra 5mm. and for the connector i had to adapt from ev1 to uscar and still cheaper than an rc injector.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Friday, January 29, 2010 12:49 PM
anyone know if srt4 injectors fit ive seen they dont but bill you just said any injector could fit??? this stuff confuses me and i need new ones lol
BuiltNBoosted wrote:and not to argue with you but read what you said....
z yaaaa wrote:running a phenolic spacer is different, unless its one to make the intake manifold match to the head when it does not. the phenolic spacers are meant to dissipate heat more, so.. they actually do serve a helpful purpose.
you said those spacers serve a purpose... do the injector spacers not serve a purpose? again not arguing just saying.
no i said they serve a HELPFUL purpose. as in a performance modification that actually HELPS with the engine.
the only helpful purpose you're spacers serve is to save a few dollars.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edited Friday, January 29, 2010 3:34 PM
so the siemens are direct replacements and are 220$ for 4... these are 280 and need spacers... im lost
LE61T PTE6262 Powered 
Too Whiney wrote:z yaaaa wrote:BuiltNBoosted wrote:and not to argue with you but read what you said....
z yaaaa wrote:running a phenolic spacer is different, unless its one to make the intake manifold match to the head when it does not. the phenolic spacers are meant to dissipate heat more, so.. they actually do serve a helpful purpose.
you said those spacers serve a purpose... do the injector spacers not serve a purpose? again not arguing just saying.
no i said they serve a HELPFUL purpose. as in a performance modification that actually HELPS with the engine.
the only helpful purpose you're spacers serve is to save a few dollars.
Oh GOD DAMN!! stop!!
whats the problem? my point was not getting across, obviously.
z yaaaa wrote:Too Whiney wrote:z yaaaa wrote:BuiltNBoosted wrote:and not to argue with you but read what you said....
z yaaaa wrote:running a phenolic spacer is different, unless its one to make the intake manifold match to the head when it does not. the phenolic spacers are meant to dissipate heat more, so.. they actually do serve a helpful purpose.
you said those spacers serve a purpose... do the injector spacers not serve a purpose? again not arguing just saying.
no i said they serve a HELPFUL purpose. as in a performance modification that actually HELPS with the engine.
the only helpful purpose you're spacers serve is to save a few dollars.
Oh GOD DAMN!! stop!!
whats the problem? my point was not getting across, obviously.
Both serve a fing purpose! that fing spacer is a very minimal gain, if any. Hell I know someone who had nothing but issues with that spacer.
FU Tuning
thats fine. i am not trying to defend the spacer's ability to work or not work.... but comparing something made to enhance performance vs something made to make something work is like comparing apples to oranges.
thats all i was trying to say.
while siemens may be a direct replacement. again he can adjust my injectors to work up above and beyond 850cc. i did not go with them simply for the fact of "making them work and save a few $" i went with them because of the backing support and i made some subaru connections as well. the support of these injectors or any injector needs i may need in the future is worth more than the $65 or so i saved. i know now regardless what i need injectors for, i know where im going for any injector i ever need. or if i ever pass up the 850cc, ill have him bore them to 1000's for a price i cant mention. Unexplainably cheaper than buying 1000's i will say. and all flow matched regardless of what cc i go with.
most people just go with cheapest. i know by going with these i saved quite a bit over the rc's but i personally cant put a price tag on continued support of them.
and BTW these siemens, i was going to go with, that are 74.80mm compared to the 79.3mm we need are still short. id rather run a full length injector. ricardo rosario is running an lsj head which is still a few mm different.
http://www.racetronix.biz/itemdesc.asp?ic=FI114991&eq=&Tp=
even the siemens deka on ebay are about $250 and only 74mm. still short.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370252777327&crlp=1_263602_263622&ff4=263602_263622&viewitem=&guid=4fa45a261260a04371c09a60ffd7cc75&rvr_id=&ua=%3F*F%3F&it
emid=370252777327
so these will be the full length needed which is what i wanted so they are not loose in the injector ports.
this just gives people another option to run injectors the correct length.
yeah. you are definitely right. the customer support is a huge selling factor for me as well.
still saying good find, vince.
but if we use the injector cups that come with the 2003+ rail doesn't that count for the lost 5 mm?
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