OK guys well recently I've been toying with the idea of some n-body swap stuff for my 97z... I'm trying to get the thing literally as light as possible and
especially when it comes to the suspension mods and unsprung weight.
I know how basically everyone wants to do the NWF for the larger front brake assemblies, yes? And getting the aluminum knuckles is just a by-product but really isnt a direct reason to do the swap... ok but what if one did not mind about the brakes being larger but wanted the benefit of not only the aluminum control arms, but
also the aluminum knuckles and also the aluminum calipers?
The way I figure it by doing the larger F-body 2 piston calipers and larger W-body rotors any weight savings your getting from the aluminum knuckles your going to be adding right back on with the beefier brake setup..
Have you so far? ok... stay with me...
taken from CTS's write up in the "sticky"...
C.T.S wrote:Upgrades our 1 piston, 10" Disk brakes
to 2 piston 12" brakes
The setup is also lighter than most big brake kits because the knuckle is aluminum (significantly lighter than the stock steel one).
C.T.S wrote:The difference, N body = 11" rotor, W body = 12" rotor and single piston, F body = 12" rotor and dual pistons.
Why couldn't one simply use
ALL of the N-body stuff, knuckles, aluminum control arms (99 only), aluminum knuckles and here's the difference maker... THE BRAKES? the stock j-body front brake assembly is 10 inches, the stock n-body brake assembly is 11 inches and the stock F-body brake assembly is 12". So... for those of you saying "well you should just do the larger brakes and be safe about it", technically... you would be because the n-body brakes are actually still an inch larger than the j-bod's.
so, why not?
Save weight from the aluminum knuckles, save weight from the aluminum control arms, save weight from the aluminum calipers, all from the n-body. you get larger than stock brakes and shave off a bunch of un-sprung weight. seems like an amazing deal if you ask me. tell me im wrong?
my plan would be to use all of the n-body stuff, but i DO NOT want the 5X115, so... planning on having them re-drilled to the j-body 5X100 along with a nice set of ARP studs since ive already got the rims i want bought for it for use while street driving and they only have a 5X100 pattern.
and here's the reasoning behind all of this...
15" aluminum weld racing rims. thats the main reason right there, because NO 15" rim will fit over the F/W body 12" brakes, HOWEVER... a 15" rim WILL fit over the n-body 11 inch setup, plenty of grand am and alero's came stock with 15" inch steelies or 15" aluminum wheels.
only thing im worried about is the hub center bore on either rim not fitting in the n-body hub. but i will check long before i start gathering parts.
so, will it work? throw some brainstorming in please!
And I should've been drown in the rivers I've found in token lost...
and i realize this has all been discussed in the sticky thread i just would like a little more input on it. thats all.
And I should've been drown in the rivers I've found in token lost...
It all sounds feasible but if you're actually going to be racing the car, the 12 inch, twin pot calipers are going to be your best bet.
I've also read too that you can do the Corvette swap with aluminum calipers, 4 or 6 pot, not sure, and better rotors. Their aftermarket rotors are better along with the Camaro rotors.
Aftermarket is where I'm going for the rotors on my eventual NWF swap or whatever hybrid I'll be going with.
There's so much information scattered around that it's hard to really nail down the exact setup that would work best for any application.
But with what's written in the sticky and elsewhere, that should be enough information along with some of your own work to get the combination you're looking for.
But again, I'd rather get the 12 inch dual pot setup as it's going offer alot more for the road course than an 11 inch single pot caliper setup.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO! 
its ok, its basically going to be a streetable drag car.
i realize having the larger brakes is safer but the only reason im want to do any of the swap is for the lightweight aluminum components.
i also toyed with idea of using the j-body hub in the n-body knuckle but even if that were possible it would be pointless since the knuckle does not have the ear that comes off it for the brake pad to stop up against. i originally just wanted to do the n-body knuckle with the j-body brakes but quickly realized that wasnt going to happen. so, then i thought well why not use the n-body brakes, there an inch bigger AND have aluminum calipers so it got even better yet.
And I should've been drown in the rivers I've found in token lost...
Does anyone really know the weight savings you are talking about? Is it 5lbs, 10lbs?? Reason I ask is you could lose that somewhere else and probably save time and money. Also not have to worry about redriling rotors as well.
FU Tuning
believe me... everywhere else has lost as much as its going to for my tastes.
its also unsprung weight. and losing unsprung helps the most.
And I should've been drown in the rivers I've found in token lost...
huh? how do you know those are 5X100?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Sunday, January 11, 2009 11:12 PM
And I should've been drown in the rivers I've found in token lost...
z yaaaa wrote:believe me... everywhere else has lost as much as its going to for my tastes.
its also unsprung weight. and losing unsprung helps the most.
The weight difference is about 2 lbs ligher a side. Thats measuring the hub, knuckle, caliper with bracket, pads and rotors. The aluminum arms would probably save another lb. or so. But the rotor is thicker and larger in diameter so it is also heavier than the j rotor.
You realize the drop in unsprung weight could also affect traction. Meaning give you less. For the little amount of weight difference I do not think it will be worth it.
FU Tuning
error.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Monday, January 12, 2009 3:44 PM
And I should've been drown in the rivers I've found in token lost...
its fine, you skeptics can do what you want, this is what i want to do.
if im the only j ever to do it, fine by me.
and to be honest, a pound here, a pound there... equals out to some decent gains. for every 100 lbs taken off the car its usually good for around a tenth in the quarter mile.
ill also be running tein ss's, and thats going to drop a whole bunch more of unsprung weight because instead of the big heavy ass stock sized springs with the big steel spring mounts on the struts, you now have a tiny short coil spring with an aluminum mount. all n all, with all the aluminum n-body parts as well as the ss's... id say losing 10lbs a corner is being modest.
getting a naturally aspirated 4 cylinder car to run high 13's is my goal. we all know how hard it is, so.. why not make the car lighter and make it easier to achieve?
and john... ok, so by your standards your saying that these guys with these lightweight bogart and weld racing rims up front are actually LOSING traction because they are in fact... LIGHTER? i dont think so...
And I should've been drown in the rivers I've found in token lost...
Maybe in dragracing applications where weight on the front tires would benefit the launch of the car. There, I could understand the effects of having a heavier assembly over aluminum.
But in a road course situation or even autocross, the lighter assemblies will help with the suspension following the imperfections in the road much better than a heavier assembly.
Getting lightweight rims would also benefit in this plus have the added bonus of less rotating mass which would mean faster acceleration in road track applications.
But I'm in agreement with Brad on this and like him, would rather have the lightest assemblies for the J but still be functional for street and track use.
When I get back from Cali in mid April, I'll be starting my NWF collection of parts to get started after the Scrapin the Coast car show event I'll be attending.
Less weight equals better power to weight ratio too.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!
well, if its only goin to be a fun car, remove all the interior, sound deadening material, change to a plastic gas tank, remove the glass(heavy), replace with lexan. wow !! lots of weight there. just my thoughts.
the plans for the interior is an acc mat carpet (has no sound deadening material), no pass. seat and no rear seat.
other than that, most of the interior stays. i just hate how gutted j's look. and plus, its going to be driven on the street to so im going to want at least SOME niceness to it. might even show the car at some point.
And I should've been drown in the rivers I've found in token lost...
Quote:
and john... ok, so by your standards your saying that these guys with these lightweight bogart and weld racing rims up front are actually LOSING traction because they are in fact... LIGHTER? i dont think so
Not my standard just the truth. If ti is for drag racing (which for you it is), and your running slicks, then probably not a big deal. Running a street drag radial, or normal street tires traction could suffer. How much hard to say. I was simply pointing something out. I totally agree losing weight is a good thing. I totally believe everything little thing helps (regardless if it is weight related or not).
FU Tuning
