Just curious to see if anyone on the boards do this with their 5 speeds.
Looking at the pedals position, it would seem quite difficult and having driven a 5 speed 1SV, could not heel/ to it at all when hitting the twisties on a modified suspension.
With my Toyota Paseo daily driver, I always heel/ toe with the car and have become quite proficient with it but driving the Cavy, not even close.
Pedal placement seems key.
I'm just curious to see if it's done by anyone here without modifying the pedals to a more ideal position.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO! 
i do it just barely though.. i have like 1 toe on the break just barely.. its easier to do when you press the break hard.
03 cavalier
us amps 100hc running at .5 ohms
digital designs 3512
yellow top g34
kenwood ddx-8019
easy to do in work boots. but in regular shoes it is very hard the gas pedal needs to be higher.
see ya!
The pedal height is way different making it damn near impossible. Talk pj about it, he was doing some research a while back on using a replacement pedal made to bring them closer together, he has started the leg work, not sure if it ever went anywhere though but it's a lead.
This is going to sound like a lame solution, but I have seen this done by professional drivers at the 12 hrs. of Sebring in $150k porsche gt-2's, which is where I got the idea.
Take off the plastic pedal pad. Take a cardboard box, and start cutting out shapes similar to the pedal, but with a corner jutting out the bottom (or whatever shape you want-bigger and closer to the brake = better). Stack them, using black duct tape to tightly hold each layer together, until you get the shape and height you want. Wrap the whole mess in an extra layer of tape, and put non-skid tape on the front. Tape/glue this mess to the original pedal pad, and put it back on. I did this myself, and it has worked well for 50k miles. I know it sounds ridiculous and cheap, but I talked to the driver when I saw that, and he insisted it was very common. Having done it, I agree. About 30 minutes and $5, and I have a perfectly customized pedal set-up.
Jimbo, that sounds like a good idea but aesthetically would be a mess.
I've actually thought of the idea of either modifying the gas pedal or the brake pedal so that they'd be closer to what they need to be when it comes to perfect pedal placement.
Ryan, PJ needs to get back to work on this as most of us that autocross or hit track days will need to be able to heel/ toe our way around corners. I'm not really sure how you autocrossers do it on the course but would gather that you're all staying in one gear.
I was just curious to see if anyone has solved this issue and it wasn't just me that couldn't get this to work.
Thanks all.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!
From my light to moderate auto-x experience in a J, 2nd gear is your utility gear, all around best accel gear and engine break gear. Then throw in some 3rd on long straight a ways. That's about it.
"Never argue with an idiot. They'll drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience!" -Anonymous
I've been wondering about this for some time also. I have my first SCCA SOLO event on June 14.
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NCR-SCCA
Its lots of fun in a Cobalt
Bear with me guys, im gonna have a noob moment.
Heel/Toe shifting. What is it? Im gathering that you use one foot for gas(toes) and braking(heel) and the other for the clutch.
Tinkles
2003 Cavalier 1SV
Bagged and Blown
Yeah, pretty much.
I usually use the balls of my right foot for braking and my heel to access the gas to rev match on the down shifts.
When done properly, it's seamless shifting and sounds so sweet.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!
depending on how hard you are on the brakes, if you position your right foot to the right side of the brake pedal, you can also rock the right side to blip the throttle for your downshift.
also, left foot braking can be utilized to help the car rotate and keep into the accelerator through a turn.
the pedals suck for heel/toe though... wrx has MUCH better pedal placement.
Tinkles wrote:Bear with me guys, im gonna have a noob moment.
Heel/Toe shifting. What is it? Im gathering that you use one foot for gas(toes) and braking(heel) and the other for the clutch.
Yup.... it's a downshifting thing...
you work the clutch with your left foot......... apply the brake with the heel of your right foot.... and blip the throttle with the toes of your right foot to rev match for the gear your down shifting to.
Your pressing all 3 pedals at once.... using you right foot for the brake and gas at the same time.... its the only way you can rev match for down shifts and apply the brake at the same time...
I dont know why people say its hard in our cars though.... I do it all the time..... I got into the habit because I had to with the transmission that was in my car (synchros where gone)... and now that its fixed... I cant make my self stop doing it even though I dont have too.
Just hold your foot a little more sideways....
Left foot braking is jabbing the brakes in a turn with your left foot while not letting off the gas the slow down a little but and help pivot the car like strat 81 said....
i was making a bolt on part to the gas pedal to raise it up to the brake, but it wasn't working out. driving the car was awkward, because you would have to slide the seat back to get proper distance from the gas and brake, but the clutch would be too far away.
I thought the gas pedal was too low, but really, our brake pedal is too high up.
the way I heel toe in the J is to use my toes on the brake pedal, and blip the throttle with my heel.
its difficult, but the only time you'd really want to heel-toe is when you're braking for a turn or in a turn, and don't want to upset traction. its impossible to rev-match while braking, which is where heel toe came around.
you can do it in a j, but its uncomfortable and difficult to master. our pedals just weren't setup for it.
Is there something different with the pedals in my car or something? ( I should really take a pic) or have I just been doing this soo long that is seems ridiculously easy?
Like I said I do it without even thinking.... in this Vid I posted on the performance forum about the resonators.... you can see that I was rev matching by heel toe braking (not a lot of brake though) going from 3rd to 2nd gear both times (back when the tranny was bad) and I didnt even realize I was doing it until I watched the video...
Link to said thread
I heel the brake and toe the throttle.... doesnt matter if im wearing boots or barefoot...
maybe my brake pedal is bent IDK LOL
Just throwing this out there:
What about those pedals that are attached to the floor? Would that make it easer / harder?
Mo Joe wrote:Just throwing this out there:
What about those pedals that are attached to the floor? Would that make it easer / harder?
That depends on the pedal placement.
Porsche has their pedals setup like this and they're heel/ toed all the time.
Once I get the 5 speed swap components, I'm going to see what can be changed or altered for better heel/ toe shifting for track days.
Ever since I've learned this and got it down pat, I've hated automatic transmissions.
Interesting info with everybody trying this and next time I get into a stick Cavy, I'll have to try it again.
Misnblu.com
Newbie member since 1999
Thank you Dave and JBO!
wwwerid, i was just thinking about this and researching it.
OK here we are.....
These are the pedals in my car (yes I know the floor is dirty and the rubber is worn / gone)
This one shows how close together the brake and gas are..
And this one shows how much closer the brake is than the gas
When I apply the brake... it moves down almost flush with the gas pedal and its easy to work them both with the same foot although my foot is pretty sideways when I do it.
its not hard to rest my heel on the brake barely applying it and snap the gas to the floor with my toes.
So whats the "ideal" setup for this?
ive never really been able to do it for some reason.. in ANY car. i guess im just not that well coordinated with my feet?
I'm tired of wasting my time... now I'm breakin' free.
Quote:
its not hard to rest my heel on the brake barely applying it and snap the gas to the floor with my toes
This is what I do, but I do not do it much,and never in autoX
FU Tuning
ive never really had a problem with it in my car. i have a big foot and i wear some wide Vans mostly when i drive, but i can even do it in the skinny Old Skool Vans i have. basically i use the balls of my feet.and toes. big toe side on the brake, little toe side on the gas, if i roll my foot enough i can just about floor the gas and still have enough foot on the brake to be functional. but thats just me
Maybee this is just one of those pat your belly and rub your head type things..
HNT on j's SUCK. can't reach it unless u got some 3" heels on.
I just used 1" spacers that are consistent with the bolts used to bolt in my pedals.
works great.
