I have been looking into this slightly (not overly hard) but can't really find @!#$ about it with cavalier's. I tried a search here but not much information that was remotely helpful.
Has anyone done a conversion? From the little I looked at it seems I would need the following
Fuel pump (pumps more than stock) [
Is This true or can the stock pump handle it? if not would something like this work?]
Fuel Lines
[Something about the stock lines not holding up? was a little confused on this one]
Injectors
[ Which makes sense since it take more e85 than gas to run]
Tuning
[ Again makes sense]
Am I missing something here? or is this all we are talking? I would assume I might need different plugs and maybe a better spark (msd coil packs maybe?)
anyone have any information that would be
GREAT
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Primer Counts as Custom Paint Right?
BTW: This is my Sig.
It takes approximately 15% more E85 than gasoline to run and it runs at a different stoichiometric point. This means you'll need to upsize your injectors by at least 15-20%. This is also why you need a stronger fuel pump.
The lines not working is because the alcohol is great at absorbing water which can rust out your stock steel lines. Get something like stainless steel lines or aluminum lines and you should be fine.
I've been considering something along this line myself because E85 has a octane rating of around 106-110. I've actually been thinking about going to straight ethanol which is even higher but that requires an extra 25% or more added to my flow rates.
I used to race cars, now I race myself.
5K PB: 24:50
10K PB: 54:26
I think one reason is that E85 is not offered everywhere so some people don't want to stuck somewhere and SOL because they can't go. Hypsy since the stoichiometry is different doesn't that mean spark timing and temp will have to change as well?
Its interesting to watch I love the idea of e85 i don't get why its so disliked. Pretty fun to watch IRL when they run it.
The proper way of using the word seen. It is not I seen it that would be I saw it. He has seen the car is the right way to use the word. English class is Cool. By the way thats my sig
well most people with a flex fuel car could just run and get normal gas and be fine if they primarly want to run e85. that is something I would have to look into further as well..
I will look into some stainless steel lines. I thought about running them anyway just need to find a decent price on them. Injectors I have and I will look into the fuel pump listed above and see what I can come up with
I guess the question would be..would it in turn be a "flex fuel" (as in you could use pump gas [probably have to be 93 octance] if you get into a jam and can't find e85)
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Primer Counts as Custom Paint Right?
BTW: This is my Sig.
A guy that I work with converted his Suburban to E85. All he did was buy a kit that cost him around $600. If you go to the web site www.changetoE85.com, they talk all about it. Realize that this site might be biased since they are selling the conversion kits.
From what I have seen and been told, you will get lees mpg using E85. As stated above, E85 is not something you can just drive up to any gas station and get. Something to consider if going to convert.
Around where I live, the difference in price is really not worth the conversion since you get less mpg than gas and I did a cost per mile and it costs more with E85 than with regular gas. That's just in my area. You might want to check around since I hear that in Colorado E85 is somewhere in the price range of $2.50/gal.
Personally, I will stick with the regular gas.
98 Z24
RIP Specks
You could easily convert it to E85. I believe the stock fuel pump should be able to keep up just fine. Only thing you'd need is the proper size injector (gotta consider flor rate on stock fuel pressure and all that good stuff) that's about 33% larger than yours (not 15% like previously stated, it's 33
. If you got the right injector you just fool the computer into thinking that it's running gasoline, though ti's not.
Cavalier2000 brings up a question. No, it would not be flexfuel. Flexfuel shows that it can run on either/or. Converting to E85 would mean that you're stuck, with E85. The computer in the J-body does not support a flexfuel sensor and if it's added it would take a lot of modification to the stock computer (probably a whole new OS).
600 for a conversion is out of hand I suppose. But I look at it in the way that you can convert for less than 100 bucks if you know what you're doing.
Cavalier2000 also mentioned the getting in a jam part. You'd be stuck with E85 once you converted. So you'd be somewhat limited on where you're getting fuel from. Like for myself, there is currently only 1 gas station locally that has E85. If I start to travel with the car then I will eventually run out of spots to put more E85 in. And in order to get an E85 station it certainly won't be as easy as just pulling off the highway and filling up.
I'm probably going to go to E85 on my Cav. For the performance value more than anything. If I go on any trips the Cav gets towed, and if I really need to I can change tunes on the computer to compensate. One problem I need to address is the need for a new fuel line. It's not possible for me now to remove my fuel filter, from the one side of the line. I can unhook the quick disconnect, but everything else is stuck. I might try a couple pairs of vice grips to see. But the issue here is that once you start running E85 you have to respect the fact that alcohol has a very good cleaning effect. So you'll need to start with a new fuel filter. Then in about 500 miles, you'll need to change it. You'll have to change it a couple of more times at somewhat short intervals before getting back to normal. But hey, at least your gas tank will be clean.
a clean tank is always nice. lol
so it would be possible to switch from e85 back to reguralr gas you would just have to change the tune. that would make sense. just have to keep both tunes on file and go from there. there are a few e85 stations currently around me and they are popping up a little more here and there..
The little research i have done on the lines got me thinking about an old company i used before on classic cars
http://www.classictube.com/
I know they can make ss lines i just wonder on the cost of it..
though i would assume a flexable hose would not hold...something like this? (because it ir rubber lined)
http://www.paragonperformance.com/fuel%20line%20hose.html
or a place like this sells ss lines by the foot.
http://www.mmsacc-stainless.com/html/tubing.htm
i would assume it would probably be cheaper to just buy the ss lines by the foot and bend it how i need it...
____________________________________
Primer Counts as Custom Paint Right?
BTW: This is my Sig.
One more thing. Anyone know the stock size fuel line off the top of thier heads?
____________________________________
Primer Counts as Custom Paint Right?
BTW: This is my Sig.
Good question, I can't even find the fuel line on gmpartsdirect under the fuel system section.
M-1 Erma Jean wrote:I think one reason is that E85 is not offered everywhere so some people don't want to stuck somewhere and SOL because they can't go. Hypsy since the stoichiometry is different doesn't that mean spark timing and temp will have to change as well?
Its interesting to watch I love the idea of e85 i don't get why its so disliked. Pretty fun to watch IRL when they run it.
Yes all your spark tables will have to be changed in some ways. As for spark temp....it's just like running high octane race gas but without the lead.
And just a FYI....IRL runs straight ethanol...not E85. E85 is a passenger car fuel mostly and is made almost exclusively using USA corn. Ethanol is a performance fuel that has actually been around for a while, just not made with USA corn until the recent past.
If I do this I'll let you all know. If you set the car up to run on E85 or ethanol you COULD use regular pump gas but you would be flowing about 15-25% more than you need, depending on if your using E85 or ethanol for racing. I wouldn't suggest E85 on a stock Cavalier though, there's just too much to swap out to make it worth it TBH.
I used to race cars, now I race myself.
5K PB: 24:50
10K PB: 54:26
True. We run E85 for a couple of reasons. For one, it's illegal to run 100% ethanol in a vehicle. One problem I guess is that people would then be able to drink it. But you could denature it with 5% gasoline. The other reason is probably to protect the oil companies. But also, climate plays a role. Under about 60-65*F ethanol will not vaporize and therefore will not ignite. A guy I work with has been having issues starting his Ranger in the morning because he's running E85. I don't think they've switched to E70 yet for the winter.
Running Ethanol doesn't take a lot to swap. Just the correct fuel injectors. That corrosion thing is just BS. I'd like to see proof that it corrodes the fuel system on j-bodies.
SHOoff (Tuner Bash Beer God) wrote:True. We run E85 for a couple of reasons. For one, it's illegal to run 100% ethanol in a vehicle. One problem I guess is that people would then be able to drink it. But you could denature it with 5% gasoline. The other reason is probably to protect the oil companies. But also, climate plays a role. Under about 60-65*F ethanol will not vaporize and therefore will not ignite. A guy I work with has been having issues starting his Ranger in the morning because he's running E85. I don't think they've switched to E70 yet for the winter.
Running Ethanol doesn't take a lot to swap. Just the correct fuel injectors. That corrosion thing is just BS. I'd like to see proof that it corrodes the fuel system on j-bodies.
I'll see if I can get pics of the fuel lines that came out of the 96 Cavalier that had been running E85 for about 4 months that my buddy just had to fix at work. On top of the normal corrosion he had holes eaten away at random spots in the lines. He has seen it on other cars too like Hondas. It doesn't eat it right away but it does wear the @!#$ out faster. It simply doesn't like aluminum and rubber.
Oh and you do need a new fuel pump if running ethanol...ethanol is very electro-conductive, unlike gasoline LOL.
Ethanol is only illegal to use in STREET vehicles. It is 100% for racing applications, just harder to find than race gas.
I used to race cars, now I race myself.
5K PB: 24:50
10K PB: 54:26
