OK we do see it a bunch on here. I'd like to make a post that we can sticky maybe and get the info straight. Here is what propose will be needed to get the 2.0 S/C motor from a Cobalt SS/Redline to run on a J-Body. This is my methodology. I posted here to get people's input on theirs. The more ways we come up with the better all our methods will prolly get.
Assuming that we are starting with a ecotec 5-speed (Although the list for 97-02 2.4 will be VERY similar)
Stuff needed from the J-Body 2.2 Eco:
Upper mounting bracket
Lower mounting bracket
Oil Pan
Throttle Body
Fuel Rail (and spacers for injectors is your rail needs it)
Transmission
(Possibly flywheel and clutch but not yet confirmed)
Custom/Aftermarket Stuff :
Adapter plate to use 2.2 Throttle Body on the 2.0 S/C snout
(Possible knock sensor work)
Block off plate for the Exhaust Cam
Custom Balancer with Fly-By magents in place for 7x crank timing
MSD Crank timing kit (or other kit/pickup to grab timing from the balancer)
MSD Cam Sync Generator
(Possibly MSD Ignition and wires depends on IDI interface...)
HPTuners for tuning it
2.0 injectors or larger depending on pulley you use
That should get it running on stock computer and wiring. They key obviously is the HPTuners tune. That could make or break it. The most expesive part I forsee is the balancer with the correct magnet placements. There are companies who make these but I lost the links. Please do not post "why not just use the 2.2?" posts as this is talked about at nausem elsewhere. This is merely to answer a question that has haunted the forums. This should work. Here is your answer, my way. Others can post thier way.
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
What tranny are you using with this? Because apparently the one attached to the 2.0SC doesn't fit.
im still waiting for someone to do this swap. not a bunch of guesses
Im a Xbox 360 fanboy...and damn proud of it!!
On that vein... I'm still waiting for a N*
Jrobz23 wrote:
Stuff needed from the J-Body 2.2 Eco:
Upper mounting bracket
Lower mounting bracket
Oil Pan
Throttle Body
Fuel Rail (and spacers for injectors is your rail needs it)
Transmission
(Possibly flywheel and clutch but not yet confirmed)
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
flywheel and clutch would be necessary. The 2.2 has a 6 bolt crank, 2.0 has 8 bolts. The pressure plate and clutch disk are also larger. The oil cooler will also need to be blocked off. I made one for mine, then stopped doing everything when I found the crank/timing issue.
12.770 @ 111.99 Intercooled Eaton M62
I was thinking that since Airtonics knows what he was doing, and being the first guy to take the Ion SC and put it on an eco, that if the 2.0 was as relatively easy as everyone thinks then you wouldn't see this:
Ebay 2.0 Auction
Instead you would see that in his cavy instead of another 2.2L engine.
But anyone who wants to this is a good place to start! everything is there, and the engine is very solid for all appearances, and if nothing else makes a good starting place for someone who wants to do a 2.0 swap.
call Crower ... pay 2500 for a forged 2.0L crank for a 2.2 ecotec! theres one option! and if you want ... snatch a head from a 2.0 and put your 2.2L S/C grind cams in it. your good to go!
This is not an Eco build thread, there already is one. This is a LSJ swap thread. ty Airtonics for the input btw that solidifies that part.
This is not to say it is the only way. You could also get crank like rawkfist said and put it in the 2.0 block. Also you can run a full distributor and wires setup. I like the setup I came up with since it could keep the most stock feel. If (IF!) you can get the machining done cheap, this setup won't be too pricey either.
a weber carb setup and a distributor would own IMO though
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
Ok idk if you know and i hope you do. The 2.0L block is exactly the same and if there not there are timing chain differences. The power plant of the 2.0L engines are the head, and the supercharger itself. Other wise it is a destroked 2.2L engine.
Maybe this swap can be done but look at it this way:
2.0L engine + wiring harnes + ecu + tranny + axles + clutch + flywheel = what $3500 possibly.
+ Spend hours of INSANITY getting the engien to just plain runing state.
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waiste of time and money.
To me the BEST way to make a "cobalt wannabe engine" is to call up Crower and have them make you a 2.0L crank for your 2.2L ecotec. If you want the highperormance of the 'balts get a stage two patriot head, or put the 2.0L head on.
$2,500 crank
+ $1,200 for patriot head or maybe 100-200 for a 2.0L head (which is optional)
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same thing with all the same tranny, flywheel, clutch, axles, electrical.
I dont want to ruin your thinking but to me the best way is swap out that crank!
actually I think the 2.0 and 2.4 blocks are different from the 2.2 found in J's (but not deltas as of 06). I think they are the gen 2 blocks with stronger webbing and some other improvements (besides the oil squirters).
Remember I wanted this post to be the answer to "how do I get it to work" not "should I get it to work" that they get in every other post, yes it is possible. You can debate which is better.
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
the 2.0 and newer 2.2 and 2.4 , use a different crank sensor and in a different location , and different count
the 2.0 is drive by wire , and the 2.0 parts to make the drive by wire work , are gonna make your hair fall out
plus if you had searched , the 2.0 trans wont fit in the J-chassis its to big , not to mention the mounts for it are alot different
im like airtonics , ive got a 2.0 lsj in the garage complete , well it was before the s/c went on the g/f's cav
Jrobz23 wrote:actually I think the 2.0 and 2.4 blocks are different from the 2.2 found in J's (but not deltas as of 06). I think they are the gen 2 blocks with stronger webbing and some other improvements (besides the oil squirters).
Remember I wanted this post to be the answer to "how do I get it to work" not "should I get it to work" that they get in every other post, yes it is possible. You can debate which is better.
Ok i see your point... SO this is what you haev to do to make it work and things you have to do:
Tranny option 1.
Use the balt tranny, tube the front end of the cavy/sunfire to make ti fit. Possibly have to move the engine towards the front of the engine bay more to allow the axles to meat up with the wheel hubs.
option 2.
Customize a Getrag tranny to fit that 2.0 (if it will allow for it) and possibly still have to tube the front to allow you to move the engine forward some to again have the axles meet the wheel hubs.
Engine components.
The 2.0 has different sensor plugs and are in a different location. Break out the wire and solder boys and guys , this will get ugly, confussing, and be a PAIN in the arse. HINT ( get a balts engine wiring harness, make it work for the 2000 ?? year cavy/sunfire cluster and tranny if auto. JUST LIKE doing a 3.8L swap!)
Flywheel and clutch. If im not mistaken the flywheel and clutchs on these 2.0's are larger or just plain different from the 2.2L Make that Getrag housethose as wheel!
The balts use a electroinc power steering pump... not to hard but need to point that out.
Radioator. Just like swapping a 2200 for a ecotec your going to need that readiator made for that engine. Get an aluminum radiator for that 2.2L to help cool down or get a stock balt radator and make it fit! Now if you use the aluminum rad. You might have to make your own coolent lines due to the fact the balts might have moved the ports do to the different sensor locations and other factors.
Axles. If you have to use the balts axles your going to need the balts wheel hubs. The teeth on the wheel hubs differ with the bolt pattern and power put down factors (can it put down this amount to this type thing)
So there ya go boys and girls ! MAKE IT HAPPEN!!! and when you do Ill personally drive to where ever you live to see it for my self and nominate that the best cav/sunfire in the U.S.A.!
[quote=97trd(???™)]the 2.0 and newer 2.2 and 2.4 , use a different crank sensor and in a different location , and different count
the 2.0 is drive by wire , and the 2.0 parts to make the drive by wire work , are gonna make your hair fall out
plus if you had searched , the 2.0 trans wont fit in the J-chassis its to big , not to mention the mounts for it are alot different
im like airtonics , ive got a 2.0 lsj in the garage complete , well it was before the s/c went on the g/f's cav
re-read my post as I accounted for everything you stated.. everything. LOL if i had searched.. funny, very funny.. try actually reading it before chimming in next time cuz its very obvious you skimmed or just didn't even read it.
To Rawk:
Great input. First off the f23 will work as is from what I've read though. as for sensor it should be just CPS and KR.. most of em are on the TB which is from the 2.2 Eco anyway. I think you can use the 2.2 Eco IDI if you want as well but I'm not sure (I'd use MSD personally but thats just me). Use the 2.2 radiator as on the Eco's they are in the same spot from every pics I've seen and from those who have fitted the 2.0 in. Use all 2.0 belt driven items. Use the 2.2 mount backets and 2.2 mounts.
but yes Rawk if you wanna use the F35 from the SS then you will prolly have to do tube your front to fit it. Also your way makes it basically a SS in a J. You could use all SS tuning stuff etc as you have the SS comp (def has its bennies). Definately a method some might pursue as thats how most swaps are done now. Mine is more making the 2.0 seem like a 2.2 to the computer and keeping stock as much as possible.
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
or you can just ignore the dip@!#$ ideas and use the correct PCM for the motor
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
by that thinking Rod anyone using HPT to control boost on an otherwise N/A motor is a dip@#$% because that is all we talking about here.
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
if you want to swap in a 2.0 simply get the engine, wiring harness and pcm , new clutch and flywheel, thats all you need, you dont need to tear it apart and trying to get it to run on a 2.2 PCM is pissing in the wind because you cannot add fuel per boost or run the MAF sensor
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
to use the 2.0 s/c computer , you need to do alot more work and need alot more parts
the 2.0 computer is gonna freak out if you try to use a cable style throttle body
and joe i did read what you put , i was more putting that out , because like airtonics i was looking at a way to use the 2.0 motor in the cav , and im still looking into making things work , but when and if i do use it , the motor is not gonna be a 2.0 , itll be a 2.2 or larger , i see no use for a small motor
to me it seems pointless to swap in that engine seeing the difficulties that everyone is encountering... it's basically the same engine with stronger internals... it certianly doesn't produce more power than the 2.2 with similar boost, so why not just build the 2.2 for less money and headaches...
unless the 2.0 was given to you, and even then just the cost of making it work is probably more than building the 2.2 bottom end to handle more boost than the stock 2.0 ever will...
some cobalt and ion guys have blown their engines in the 300-350 whp range (or so I've heard)... to me that's week on a built engine... a 2.2 will get you close enough to that and last if you don't drive like a maniac...
14.425 @ 97.833 mph stock + GMPP s/c on drag radials.
^^^ i like how this guy thinks even thought a 2.0 s/c would slighty loose to a evently matched 2.2 s/c with the same internals, same mods, etc. The only thing that keeps the 2.0 up there is the head. it has a better flow rate stock on the S/C version then the stock 2.2L does.
This swap is not overly worth it now for Eco J's IMO, but may be in the future as LSJ's become more and more prevelant. The square ratio could be saught after by some, oil squirters by others. People swap motors for all different reasons. I just wanted to give JBO a way to do it, and let them decide. Also, I wanted to clear up some misinformation flying around. Engines are not innately tied to a PCM and vice versa. That idea should be removed from JBO thinking altogether.
Rod if YOU can add fuel for boost with HPT then so can anyone with a LSJ in their J. And yes, it would be a nightmare getting the wiring of a CAN setup into a J. btw sorry TRD that I flew off the handle, but it seems that whenever I post a method for doing a swap other than the "swap everything" method people call me retarded before even thinking about it.
Sven you totally quarterloafed your computer..
