Well, I just talked to an engine performance shop about 20 mins away from me. I asked around and my g/f's uncle races stock cars and he told me about the guy. Anyway, I called him up, and he says he does a lot of work on 4 cyls. and has also worked on 2.4L engines in the past. He sounded very knowledgeable in what he was doing. I am confident that he will do a good job. He quoted me $400 to clean the block, check it, balance everything, and assemble the complete bottom end, and bolt on the head. I thought that sounded like a pretty good price. I also asked him about the 2.3L oil pump swap, and he says he does lots of custom block work, so if I have pictures, he said he would easily be able to do it for me. Looks that that is the route I am going. Here is my build list:
10:1 JE Pistons
Eagle Rods
Clevite 77 Main & Rod Bearings
ARP Head & Main Studs
2.3L Oil Pump Conversion
Fel-Pro Head Gasket Set (Plan on doing head work later on..no sense in using a Cometic)
The guy also suggested that I have the crank hardened. He said that they have a nitride treatment process to harden it and it works very well and helps with wear issues. I have read before that stock cranks are pretty tough and don't need to be hardened. It's about $175 to be hardened. Any opinions on that?
Otherwise, does anyone see any parts that I am missing or should add to my list? I might as well do it right the first time so I don't have to do this all over again.
2010 Subaru Impreza WRX Limited
1999 Cavalier Z24 Supercharged
1999 Grand AM SE (Beater Car)
1997 GMC Sierra
2007 Honda CBR 600RR
2005 Honda TRX450R
Add a minimum .02" over bore to that list to ensure a nice cylinder wall.
As for hardening the crank, considering that i've never heard of anyone breaking a 2.4 crank and with your supercharger your going to peak around 225whp i'd say its a big waste of money.
- 93 mph in the 1/8 mile
Member of J-Body Of Michigan.
^^Woops, I forgot to mention that those pistons are .040" overbore.
That's what I was thinking as far as the crank goes. I don't have the extra money to spend on it anyway.
2010 Subaru Impreza WRX Limited
1999 Cavalier Z24 Supercharged
1999 Grand AM SE (Beater Car)
1997 GMC Sierra
2007 Honda CBR 600RR
2005 Honda TRX450R
keep in mind MLS cometic are reusable.
HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED
ge_forcez22 wrote:keep in mind MLS cometic are reusable.
Hmmmm..That's good to know. I have had other people tell me not to bother with it since they aren't reusable....
2010 Subaru Impreza WRX Limited
1999 Cavalier Z24 Supercharged
1999 Grand AM SE (Beater Car)
1997 GMC Sierra
2007 Honda CBR 600RR
2005 Honda TRX450R
Skilz10179 wrote:Add a minimum .02" over bore to that list to ensure a nice cylinder wall.
As for hardening the crank, considering that i've never heard of anyone breaking a 2.4 crank and with your supercharger your going to peak around 225whp i'd say its a big waste of money.
Little higher than that.............depending on cams.
crank harding, its also knewn as Cryo treating, good stuf, 300 below does it out of ILL. but think it would be a wast of money.
Chris
'02 Z-24 Supercharged
13.7 @102.45 MPH Third Place, 2007 GMSC Bash SOLD AS OF 01MAR08
Taetsch Z24 wrote:Skilz10179 wrote:Add a minimum .02" over bore to that list to ensure a nice cylinder wall.
As for hardening the crank, considering that i've never heard of anyone breaking a 2.4 crank and with your supercharger your going to peak around 225whp i'd say its a big waste of money.
Little higher than that.............depending on cams.
crank harding, its also knewn as Cryo treating, good stuf, 300 below does it out of ILL. but think it would be a wast of money.
Chris
Cams won't make the M45 flow any more air.....
- 93 mph in the 1/8 mile
Member of J-Body Of Michigan.
PSI is just a mhermint of resistence,
there is an old "equasion" __ the more efisent you make the motor NA, the more power it will make bosted,
case in point,
Speedracer
NA motor, built, BUT for boost, and hes at what most people run WITH THE CHARGER , but with LOW compression and a LO cam in the mix.
so i make this statment
---- a built 2.4, with HO cams and the 2.3 oil pump, worked up head, 10:1 pistions, with the charger and all its suporteing mods. will be enuf to break in to the 12's
and to do that a car of the Jbodys weaght needs around 300 hp......
think I'm wrong?
Chris
'02 Z-24 Supercharged
13.7 @102.45 MPH Third Place, 2007 GMSC Bash SOLD AS OF 01MAR08
Quote:
Cams won't make the M45 flow any more air.....
True, but that is when we get the blower ported
Or wait another couple of years for a M62 intake manifold that will never happen. Either way, I think we are way outside of Luke's budget at the moment
Jason
99 Z24
157hp/171tq
wheres my boost??
damn i should have cheeked my spelling, sorry guys.
Chris
'02 Z-24 Supercharged
13.7 @102.45 MPH Third Place, 2007 GMSC Bash SOLD AS OF 01MAR08
Jason wrote:
.....Or wait another couple of years for a M62 intake manifold that will never happen. Either way, I think we are way outside of Luke's budget at the moment
LOL, so very true. The M62 manifold I doubt will ever happen. It just seems to drag on and on. I was hopeful for a while, but I've lost most hope. And as far as out of budget goes, you are damn right about that. I can barely pull off the build. Let alone tuning that has to be done before the s/c goes back on. I have no idea where that money is coming from yet. College is so damn expensive..that's where most of my money has been going :-(
2010 Subaru Impreza WRX Limited
1999 Cavalier Z24 Supercharged
1999 Grand AM SE (Beater Car)
1997 GMC Sierra
2007 Honda CBR 600RR
2005 Honda TRX450R
Just make sure whatever happens that the meth/water/alky/w/e you wanna call it goes on asap if your running at 10:1 CR
Luke Heier wrote:Jason wrote:
.....Or wait another couple of years for a M62 intake manifold that will never happen. Either way, I think we are way outside of Luke's budget at the moment
LOL, so very true. The M62 manifold I doubt will ever happen.
don't lose hope. I'm just waiting on someone to send me some measurements of the ss/redline's m62, then it'll be in the works by my friend in cali. He's a metal working guru. And also I'm having hime send me that red blower which is the 2 piece design, and if need be I'll have a local guy fab it up for us if my cali connection takes too long.
If anyone who has an m62 can send me some measurements from it, PM me
'00 Grand Am 2.4L LD9
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/816505
Yeah, don't worry. The S/C isn't going back on until I have bigger injectors, alky injection, and HPTuners.
2010 Subaru Impreza WRX Limited
1999 Cavalier Z24 Supercharged
1999 Grand AM SE (Beater Car)
1997 GMC Sierra
2007 Honda CBR 600RR
2005 Honda TRX450R
Taetsch Z24 wrote:PSI is just a mhermint of resistence,
I never said anything about psi, i only mentioned the amount of air it can flow.
Taetsch Z24 wrote:there is an old "equasion" __ the more efisent you make the motor NA, the more power it will make bosted,
This is very true but it doesn't change the facts. A M45 spinning 14,000rpm flows about 325 cfm which is enough cfm to make roughly 215whp. Do whatever you like to the motor to make it more efficient but the M45 will still be spinning the same speed and flowing the exact same cfm it was on the stock motor. By making the motor flow air more efficiently you can reduce the amount of power consuption from the blower by making it easier to push the air into the motor but it will not yeild a drastic gain in peak hp.
Taetsch Z24 wrote:case in point,
Speedracer
NA motor, built, BUT for boost, and hes at what most people run WITH THE CHARGER , but with LOW compression and a LO cam in the mix.
Ok, i don't see what that has to do with any of this.
Taetsch Z24 wrote:so i make this statment
---- a built 2.4, with HO cams and the 2.3 oil pump, worked up head, 10:1 pistions, with the charger and all its suporteing mods. will be enuf to break in to the 12's
and to do that a car of the Jbodys weaght needs around 300 hp......
think I'm wrong?
Chris
Wrong? Yes. It will make nowhere near 300hp.
I have seen with my own eyes a car dyno with the following mods:
GMPP m45 S/C
2.4" pulley boys quick change pulley
2.3L 60MM TB
custom intake
4-1 header
2.5" QTP exhaust cut out
2.5" high flow cat
2.5" rear exhaust
ported head
2.3L HO intake cam
2.3 HO exhaust cam
2.3L oil pump swap
Eagle forged rods
ARP main studs
ARP head studs
Cometic MLS head gasket
P&P head
Stainless valves
Spec 3 clutch
A/C removal
Fidenza flywheel
10:1 CR Diamond pistons
It put down a best of 226whp with the exahust cut out open.
- 93 mph in the 1/8 mile
Member of J-Body Of Michigan.
little FYI for some guys on here, some of us know lots about cars, and others are just starting and others are in the middle... Skilz is in the upper class on this forum and has experience with a whole bunch. And thankfully he still takes time for some of the newer people.. until he moves to a different platform
HP Tuners | Garrett T3/T04B | 2.5" Charge Pipes | 2.5" Downpipe | 650 Injectors | HO Manifold | Addco front/rear | Motor Mounts | HKS SSQV | Spec stage 3 | AEM UEGO Wideband | Team Green LSD | FMIC | 2.3 cams | 2.3 oil pump swap | 280WHP | Now ECOTECED
Damn Luke you're making me want to build up my extra motor!
Car is for Sale!Supercharger kit is for sale!
Since when did Pulley Boys make a 2.4" pulley for the M45 charger? 2.5" is the smallest I know of.
Anyway, I'm not expecting big horsepower out of the M45. I hope to be in the 13's as far as 1/4 mile times go. I'm not HUGE into racing. I just want a reliable car, that has a good amount of power and is fun to play around with. And also fast enough to take it to the track where I can put up a 'lil competition..and not be up against 3 other cars in the 16 second bracket. For the time being anyway....
That's why I am going to build this motor to handle lot's of power. That way when I get more money, and really wanna make it fast, all I have to do is slap on a nice turbo setup and get it tuned. But as far as my money situation goes right now, the M45 is all I can afford, and I am aware of its limits, and for now am happy with that. Key words: "For Now" LOL
Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Thursday, January 11, 2007 2:41 PM
2010 Subaru Impreza WRX Limited
1999 Cavalier Z24 Supercharged
1999 Grand AM SE (Beater Car)
1997 GMC Sierra
2007 Honda CBR 600RR
2005 Honda TRX450R
And Skilz, I appreciate your input on this. I know you've been around for a while and really know your stuff. I have always admired your car :-)
And Bobby, sorry for making you want to build your extra motor :-) I'll send you some videos once I get it running, to really put in the clincher :-) But I really shouldn't be sorry, because you make me want to send in my charger to have it polished and ported
Back on topic, is there anything that anyone thinks I should add to my build list for the bottom end, or is it looking good?
2010 Subaru Impreza WRX Limited
1999 Cavalier Z24 Supercharged
1999 Grand AM SE (Beater Car)
1997 GMC Sierra
2007 Honda CBR 600RR
2005 Honda TRX450R
It propably wouldn't hurt to get the pistons coated by Swain or HBC.
Jason
99 Z24
157hp/171tq
wheres my boost??
well see.
what kind of timing was he running, the awsome 12 degrees avd of the stock reflash?
all im saying is this, it is posable. i just may spray for it though.
Chris
'02 Z-24 Supercharged
13.7 @102.45 MPH Third Place, 2007 GMSC Bash SOLD AS OF 01MAR08
bottles are for babies.......
01' Z24 5 speed
422whp/400wtq
T4 Turbocharged
Built LD9
HP Tuners
so are clear tail lights.
Chris
'02 Z-24 Supercharged
13.7 @102.45 MPH Third Place, 2007 GMSC Bash SOLD AS OF 01MAR08
Luke Heier wrote:Since when did Pulley Boys make a 2.4" pulley for the M45 charger? 2.5" is the smallest I know of.
Anyway, I'm not expecting big horsepower out of the M45. I hope to be in the 13's as far as 1/4 mile times go. I'm not HUGE into racing. I just want a reliable car, that has a good amount of power and is fun to play around with. And also fast enough to take it to the track where I can put up a 'lil competition..and not be up against 3 other cars in the 16 second bracket. For the time being anyway....
That's why I am going to build this motor to handle lot's of power. That way when I get more money, and really wanna make it fast, all I have to do is slap on a nice turbo setup and get it tuned. But as far as my money situation goes right now, the M45 is all I can afford, and I am aware of its limits, and for now am happy with that. Key words: "For Now" LOL
a built 2.4 with m45 and 2.6" pully can break into the 13's with a decent tune. Hell i almost did it all charger. I had a downpipe to cat exhaust leak, fuel cut, misfires AND street tires and pulled a 14.3@101, and i have 9:1 CR with a thinner HG so with your 10:1 you should be 13's for sure with a nice tune. If i had to redo my motor i'd do 10:1 CR but thats all in the past, im still running strong and decent for what it is.
Publikdstrbnce wrote:bottles are for babies.......
So says the guy who squeaked into the 15s by the skin of his nuts...
BOOSTED wrote:a built 2.4 with m45 and 2.6" pully can break into the 13's with a decent tune. Hell i almost did it all charger. I had a downpipe to cat exhaust leak, fuel cut, misfires AND street tires and pulled a 14.3@101, and i have 9:1 CR with a thinner HG so with your 10:1 you should be 13's for sure with a nice tune. If i had to redo my motor i'd do 10:1 CR but thats all in the past, im still running strong and decent for what it is.
101mph?!?!?!?!? holy crap that thing must have been pulling like crazy at the end! My highest ever trap was never over 97
14.330 @ 96.37mph
