I'm looking for a 3 bar map sensor and am wondering where people are ordering theirs from. I found a site (xenocron) that has them for $60 but it says "Comes with new sensor, weatherpack pigtail connection with pins and directions for the most common Honda wiring. This sensor allows you to run up to approximately ~29 psi of boost on Speed Density based engine management systems." Its a GM 3 bar map sensor but am wondering if it would still work for my car. Here is the link:
link...
If there is a better place to get it from let me know, but this is the best deal I have found yet.
Sounds like a waste of time and money to me.....
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
Not sure what you mean by a waste. If I remember correct a 2 bar map sensor is good for 14.8psi which is not going to be good for me so I would need to run a 3 bar map sensor. So in order to tune my car properly I would need the 3 bar, so if you wouldn't mind justifying why you think its a waste of time and money then that may help me out/make things more clear to me.
QWK LN2 (aka ImPhat0260) wrote:Sounds like a waste of time and money to me.....
great talk!!!
bump for an answer. I vote on calling xenocron
Matthew Jollymore wrote:I'm looking for a 3 bar map sensor and am wondering where people are ordering theirs from. I found a site (xenocron) that has them for $60 but it says "Comes with new sensor, weatherpack pigtail connection with pins and directions for the most common Honda wiring. This sensor allows you to run up to approximately ~29 psi of boost on Speed Density based engine management systems." Its a GM 3 bar map sensor but am wondering if it would still work for my car. Here is the link:
link...
If there is a better place to get it from let me know, but this is the best deal I have found yet.
If you're speed density like me - when you enter Power Enrichment your fueling is set by TPS and RPM so why would you need a 3 BAR map - it will just hose up your off boost resolution.
kevo1586 . wrote:QWK LN2 (aka ImPhat0260) wrote:Sounds like a waste of time and money to me.....
great talk!!!
bump for an answer. I vote on calling xenocron
It was, wasn't it!
The aswers are already out there, and in multiple places... Just need to search for them...
Matthew Jollymore wrote:Not sure what you mean by a waste. If I remember correct a 2 bar map sensor is good for 14.8psi which is not going to be good for me so I would need to run a 3 bar map sensor. So in order to tune my car properly I would need the 3 bar, so if you wouldn't mind justifying why you think its a waste of time and money then that may help me out/make things more clear to me.
Fair enough... Lost resolution that is already poor with the SC Reflash. This means your driveability will suffer... Don't know about you, but last time I checked, I drove my car mosty out of boost. If it was strictly a "racecar", this probably would not matter much then.
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
heavyclutch wrote:Matthew Jollymore wrote:I'm looking for a 3 bar map sensor and am wondering where people are ordering theirs from. I found a site (xenocron) that has them for $60 but it says "Comes with new sensor, weatherpack pigtail connection with pins and directions for the most common Honda wiring. This sensor allows you to run up to approximately ~29 psi of boost on Speed Density based engine management systems." Its a GM 3 bar map sensor but am wondering if it would still work for my car. Here is the link:
link...
If there is a better place to get it from let me know, but this is the best deal I have found yet.
If you're speed density like me - when you enter Power Enrichment your fueling is set by TPS and RPM so why would you need a 3 BAR map - it will just hose up your off boost resolution.
Wrong. Your car is Alpha -N.
Speed Density is MAP x RPM.
I'm with Ryan. Really how much boost you planning to run? DO you know, I know your goal was 300whp?
Also Ryan has tuned a 551whp LD9 and Ryan what map sensor was used?
FU Tuning
Yeah - My bad - Alpha-N sorry for the misinformation. Angle - Speed
I have a 17psi wg spring coming but I may run more, depends on how it dyno's. Somewhere in the range of 15-20psi is what I'm planning on running.
Matthew Jollymore wrote:I have a 17psi wg spring coming but I may run more, depends on how it dyno's. Somewhere in the range of 15-20psi is what I'm planning on running.
I have taken both Fetter's and mine to 25psi + on the 2bar. Figure out what it likes on the dyno, set and leave it alone.....
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
Soon our car will be at 25 psi + with the 2 bar
So I have the 2 bar map that came with the GM s/c kit so would I ok to use that with upwards of 15psi? From what I am gathering it will be as you were able to run more than 15psi on the 2 bar.
You can run 50psi on a 1 or 2 bar map sensor doesn't matter really.
If you get a 3 bar map your ECU will not know the difference. Your ECU will still have the same KPA readings to tune. Using a 2 bar more with 15+ psi you just tune the last cell for that.
Hope that makes more sense.
FU Tuning
well I am not 100% sure on this but as far as I know the map sensor can read pressure values of (the sensor's bar rating) - 1 bar e.g. 4 bar sensor - 1 bar = ability to read 3 bar
And it works by measuring pressure and converting it into a voltage which is read by the ECU and can determine the proper amount of fuel to provide. But I believe the ECU has to recognize the particular map sensor (and bar rating) in order to scale the voltage readings for accuracy. I am not very familiar with HP tuners but I know almost every Honda tuning has this capabilty (from free programs like Crome to more expensive ones like Hondata).
And AFIK the tuning program would have to have enough mbar columns to allow you to tune these particular "new" pressures you are capable of seeing. So if the computer isn't capable of telling the difference between different map sensors I guess it wouldn't really do you much good.
And if the ECU couldn't tell the difference I guess you would just have to tune the final mbar column to be able to properly run your highest boost pressure. That's how I understand it, but an not 100% sure if it's correct.
But what do I know, I drive a Honda
So is HPtuners able to recognize different map sensors in order to provide scaling?
kevo1586 . wrote:So is HPtuners able to recognize different map sensors in order to provide scaling?
The Jbody PCM is not capable of this.....
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
Then if HPtuners is not able to to recognize different map sensors then it cannot provide proper scaling to maintain proper afr's.
So as far as I can tell...
The answer to the this whole scenario is... HPtuners lacks the capabilities to make use of a higher bar map sensor than what he currently has. From my understanding of this whole situation, it is not that it isn't worth it to upgrade to a higher bar map sensor but HPtuners is currently unable to reap the benefits that could be achieved.
So... in short
it is worth it to upgrade if the program can tell what map sensor you are using.
it is not worth it to upgrade if the program can not tell what map sensor you are using. (You are actually worse off)
HPtuners cannot tell the difference therefore it is not worth it.
If HPtuners gets these capabilities in the future it would be worth it to upgrade.
Can someone confirm my thoughts?
kevo1586 . wrote:Then if HPtuners is not able to to recognize different map sensors then it cannot provide proper scaling to maintain proper afr's.
So as far as I can tell...
The answer to the this whole scenario is... HPtuners lacks the capabilities to make use of a higher bar map sensor than what he currently has. From my understanding of this whole situation, it is not that it isn't worth it to upgrade to a higher bar map sensor but HPtuners is currently unable to reap the benefits that could be achieved.
So... in short
it is worth it to upgrade if the program can tell what map sensor you are using.
it is not worth it to upgrade if the program can not tell what map sensor you are using. (You are actually worse off)
HPtuners cannot tell the difference therefore it is not worth it.
If HPtuners gets these capabilities in the future it would be worth it to upgrade.
Can someone confirm my thoughts?
Its not HP Tuners that can't tell what is going on, its the PCM itself. HPT does lack some tables/support for our platform, but we are more limited to the coding in the PCM. As for the upgrading MAP sensor question, leave it alone.... As I stated before, if the PCM has the LD9 SC reflash (a hack in itself), it already has choppy resolution. If you are Alpha N, the only thing a bigger MAP sensor will do is alter your idle fueling and timing, again giving you less driveability and lower resolution to work with...
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
Help I have 99 cavalier 2200 with turbo 8psi and 32lb injectors. I now have hp tuner software and I am trying to get started tuning. I think I can figure out of starting injector constant by what I have read. I am not sure how to set up for the turbo so the computer can read the boost. Do i need to fake the boost, use the gm reflash or what is the best way to do it? If anyone has any files or can help can email at shall69@aol.com
