So I was doing some turbo research. I was looking at the stage 1 Hahn Kit for the 2200, and have been talking with Cavattack2000 a little...so I decided to do a little research and came to some startling conclusions....
...one being I need to quit reading the Honda forums.
So I'm searching the interweb and noticed the Hahn Kit uses a 15g Mitsubishi Turbo, which isn't bad. It's actually quite comparable to the other turbo recommended by the guy I was talking to, which was a T3 Super 60 .48 a/r. Both will spool relatively the same, but I keep hearing that the T3 will spool later, with higher CFM for more power on less pressure on my motor, which I was all for, aside from the boost lag.
Then I kept seeing that the T3 was really beneficial to a high revving motor...and I stopped and thought, Damn...I don't rev past 6K, and I really don't want to, saying as the Honda guys were spouting numbers like 7K or 8K on the tach, and I'm like GUFFAH!
And then it hit me...
Turbos spool because of exaust pressure
These honda are running 1.5's and 1.8L engines
These engine were originally built for fuel economy, not to run turbos
I wonder what their exaust pressures are?
And then it hit me again!
Why am I worrying about the civic's exaust pressure?
I'm running a 2.2 motor, with a higher displacement, therefore with a good port and polish should be producing FAR higher exhaust pressures than an anemic little Civic 4cyl
...so, shouldn't I be able to spool the same turbo at a lower RPM?
Higher rate of flow across the hotside of the turbo would equate to a faster spool, correct?
Therefore, the T3 on the Cavalier would work flawlessly, and I'd reach full boost at a lower RPM, right?
Please, feel free to chime in. I'm new to turbos...just doing my research, thought I'd get some advice.
From anything I have ever heard people make fun of hondas, the thing is. The good ones on the forum know their @!#$. They will try anything once and if it works, great. If not they will try something else. If you want to learn turbo stuff learn it from there
I'm not bashing the honda guys, I'm bashing myself for relating a smaller displacement honda engine to mine. It's hard to compare boost, spool rates, blah blah on an engine with 400cc's difference in displacement.
From what I have read the T3 Super 60 is a great all around turbo for our DOHC engines that is a good choice for a daily driver, not sure about the 2200 tho. Im no expert but Im sure it would be a good turbo for your app.
T3 super 60 is what is on my 2.4, 2400-2700 Im pretty close to full boost. Not bad on lag at all. But like zs z said....not sure about the 2200.
Your WHAT hurts?
The T3 Super 60 is perfect for a daily driven 2200..... When I orignally turboed my car 8 years ago, thats what I used and it was great...
P&P Tuning
420.5whp / 359.8wtq
QWK LN2 (needs an @ss whoopin) wrote:The T3 Super 60 is perfect for a daily driven 2200..... When I orignally turboed my car 8 years ago, thats what I used and it was great...
any 2200 turbo answer you ever need ^^^ that guy
I also ran a T3 Super 60 on a 2200 8 years ago for the first boosted J I built and it was perfect for it. Spools plenty fast and is great for a mild daily.
What forums you find your information from is sort of irrelevant so long as you are getting it from people who actually know what they are talking about. People that are actually fundamentally competent in the area that you are inquiring about will be able to apply what they know to any engine and application. There's tons of mis-information no matter what forum you go to.
ASE Master Certified Automotive Technician
I ran a 60-trim T3 (not the 'super' wheel, but
very close) and it was great for a daily.
fortune cookie say: better a delay than a disaster
CaliforniaDomestics wrote:I also ran a T3 Super 60 on a 2200 8 years ago for the first boosted J I built and it was perfect for it. Spools plenty fast and is great for a mild daily.
What forums you find your information from is sort of irrelevant so long as you are getting it from people who actually know what they are talking about. People that are actually fundamentally competent in the area that you are inquiring about will be able to apply what they know to any engine and application. There's tons of mis-information no matter what forum you go to.
this guy knows his stuff too....about any jbody motor boosted or n/a
Yellow Cav Guy wrote:
Turbos spool because of exaust pressure
This is sort of correct. In the same vane as the "exhaust pressure vs exhaust velocity" issue for Naturally Aspirated engines, turbo's technically spool because of exhaust inertia. Pressure really isn't the cause, but rather the side-effect. Maintaining a pressure differential between intake and exhaust manifolds is a big part of making power in a turbocharged engine.
Yellow Cav Guy wrote:
These honda are running 1.5's and 1.8L engines
These engine were originally built for fuel economy, not to run turbos
I wonder what their exaust pressures are?
Some of the B-series engines were built specifically for racing. These engines, although smaller, have their peak efficiencies higher in the RPM band, so although they are physically smaller displacement engines, in their powerband, they are moving more air than you are in your powerband.
Yellow Cav Guy wrote:And then it hit me again!
Why am I worrying about the civic's exaust pressure?
I'm running a 2.2 motor, with a higher displacement, therefore with a good port and polish should be producing FAR higher exhaust pressures than an anemic little Civic 4cyl
...so, shouldn't I be able to spool the same turbo at a lower RPM?
If the engine you are comparing to flows less than your engine does in its powerband, then yes, you should be spooling sooner.
Yellow Cav Guy wrote:
Higher rate of flow across the hotside of the turbo would equate to a faster spool, correct?
correct
Yellow Cav Guy wrote:
Therefore, the T3 on the Cavalier would work flawlessly, and I'd reach full boost at a lower RPM, right?
Not all T3's are the same. If you include T3/T4's and some BW turbos, I can name a few that you could never spool without a race-built 2200 ( or ECO or LD9 for that matter). If you are referring to a super 60 or similar size turbo, then sure.
On a side note: Honda-tech.com has some of the most intelligent and experienced people in the 4-cylinder world. Some of the best information on the web can be found there. They make most of the members on this site look like hillbillies with a wrench.
I have no signiture
