Quote:
Way back in 1987, Chrysler bought up a troubled Lamborghini, and within two years put it to work developing a V10 engine program that would eventually give birth to both the Dodge Viper and the Lamborghini Gallardo – two of the first ten-cylinder engines on the modern market. Two decades later, the tables have turned: instead of buying up struggling Italian automakers, it's Chrysler that's troubled and the Italians are coming to the rescue. And now reports suggest that the replacement for the Viper's V10 could be derived from Ferrari's next-generation engine program.
Chrysler's original plan was to sell of the Viper business, but since no serious offers came through, Fiat CEO Sergio Marchionne is reportedly keen on taking advantage of the sportscar's standing as the company's halo vehicle. But rather than have Chrysler shoulder the entire burden of developing the next-generation Viper, the engine program could be derived from the same modular powerplant that will propel upcoming Ferraris and Maseratis.
Ferrari has essentially had four engine designs in its history: the Colombo design was in use from the company's beginnings all the way through the '90s. The Lampredi engine was used on a handful of vehicles in the 50's before being phased out. The Dino engine spawned V6, V8 and V12 versions and was in use until just a few years ago, while the current Ferrari/Maserati engine powers everything in the both companies' current ranges as well as the Alfa Romeo 8C Competizione. Its 90-degree replacement will likewise offer variable configurations: a flat-plane crank V8 for Ferrari, a cross-plane crank for Maserati and a pushrod V10 for the Viper.
My take on this? Bad idea. The Viper isn't about modern, top of the line performance and technology. It's about being batsh*t excessive. The Ferrari engine that they're talking about here would be about 6.0 liters in size and make 600+hp. Nice, but it's not what the Viper needs. What they should do is offer it with either a 490 cubic inch Hemi V10 or 588 cubic Hemi V12. Both could be built from the coming 392 SRT Hemi V8. Setup like that would make between 650 and 800hp, more with a Supercharger or Turbo. THAT is what the Viper needs, not a high revving formula one race bred european engine. Not because Ferrari can't make a good motor, but because it doesn't have that HOLY SH*T!!! quality that the Viper needs.
Get Ferrari to do the suspension and transmission. Iron out some of the kinks and make the car less dangerous to drive. They would be welcome to fiddle around with it on that level. However, a proper Viper should feel like a scary fast race car that someone put nice seats, not something that you drive to the Playboy mansion to impress the ladies.
well.... it still has pushrods, how high tech and high revving can it be?
KG wrote:well.... it still has pushrods, how high tech and high revving can it be?
This is Ferrari were talking about, they can do amazing things with engines.
But yeah seems like a bad idea. Personally I think they should let the failure that is the Viper die.
Paying someone to install parts and bragging about it being fast, is like watching someone bang your wife and being proud to raise their kids.
yeah, let them do the tranny and suspension. something f-1'ish, but the motor should be a huge displacement monster that makes 600+hp and 850+ ftlbs. thats why the viper is what it its. a straight race car with leather seats and no cage.
The Viper was never a failure. It has become the only American car to successfully threaten the Corvette as America's most impressive car. Sure it's bare-bones and flimsy. Yes, it's got parts out of a Dakota. So what? The Viper is the closest thing you'll ever be able to buy new that even comes close to being an honest to God race car. In fact, if anything they should go back to that pure stripped down feel and bring back the Roadster with no roof or side windows as a base model.
Lol think they would be able to keep the (around about) price tag of 80k? I dun think soo.
Bolting 800hp to a tractor chassis does not constitute threatening the Vette IMO. It sold very few numbers, critics thought it was a piece of crap, you would burn yourself trying to get out of the car because you had to climb over the exhaust, it gave up half way through turns... If that's not failure I don't know what is.
Do you forget about the GT40?
Paying someone to install parts and bragging about it being fast, is like watching someone bang your wife and being proud to raise their kids.
i'd like to drive one. would never buy one.
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Knoxfire Esquire wrote:The Viper was never a failure. It has become the only American car to successfully threaten the Corvette as America's most impressive car. Sure it's bare-bones and flimsy. Yes, it's got parts out of a Dakota. So what? The Viper is the closest thing you'll ever be able to buy new that even comes close to being an honest to God race car. In fact, if anything they should go back to that pure stripped down feel and bring back the Roadster with no roof or side windows as a base model.
This.
Not to mention the Viper can turn with the very best and post better times and numbers then the Vette. The ACR, heck it is almost a street-legal race car.
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I'm sorry but the Viper cannot turn, especially with the best. That would imply it could keep up with a Lotus or GTR through a turn, and that just isn't going to happen.
It was built for straight line speed, that's all it will ever do.
Paying someone to install parts and bragging about it being fast, is like watching someone bang your wife and being proud to raise their kids.
Transporter7220 wrote:Bolting 800hp to a tractor chassis does not constitute threatening the Vette IMO. It sold very few numbers, critics thought it was a piece of crap, you would burn yourself trying to get out of the car because you had to climb over the exhaust, it gave up half way through turns... If that's not failure I don't know what is.
Do you forget about the GT40?
The GT40 was a straight race car and was made to compete with Ferrari's at LeMans. The Corvette was a street car and didn't even come close to that level of performance. The only GM-ish car that could keep up was the Lola T70 and that was mostly a British car. Come to think of it so was the GT40.
As for the Viper, I can't think of any serious car journalist that thought it was a piece of crap when it came to performance. Sure it wasn't the most well assembled thing in the world. Did you ever sit in a race car? Everything that isn't needed to make it go fast is cheap and flimsy. Same with the Viper. The first year had some mechanical issues but overall it's a tank now. I can't think of ANY negative criticism of that car being thrown around since 1993 that involves it's performance. In fact, the only complaints I've seen have to do with the fact that it doesn't come with an automatic or have a big enough cupholders, which isn't exactly the sort of thing the Viper was built for. This is a car with little electronic gizmos and it WILL kill you if you screw up behind the wheel.
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Even super critical Jeremy Clarkson likes it.
As for selling low numbers. The production numbers for Bugatti, Ferrari and Lamborghini
combined are less than for one year of the Corvette. Hardly meaningful. I'll bet Rolls Royce sells less cars than Cadillac or Lincoln too.
The 2008 GT40, not the original.
And that was hardly a good review from him, he says right in the review that the chassis has no finesse, brakes are horrible. And it's no faster than the Bimmer!
I'm sorry I just don't see why people think it's so good. Just my opinion.
Also interesting how he gets into the Vette at the end...
Paying someone to install parts and bragging about it being fast, is like watching someone bang your wife and being proud to raise their kids.
Transporter7220 wrote:The 2008 GT40, not the original.
FYI its the Ford GT, not the GT40. Thats where the confusion came from.
Viper? A failure? Are you serious?
The Viper was not a refined vehicle. But it sure as hell wasn't a failure either. And FYI, Viper's sold just as well as any other $80k sportscar would.
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Later generation Vipers were great performers. IF I remember correctly as GWrench has shown.. They lapped the N-ring in record times.
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I give up...
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NUTCASE . wrote:have we forgotten about the viper acr that posted quicker times around the ring than the GTR.....without a running start, and without shaved tires
not a viper fan, just figured I would say that
That video is great. Loooove the sound of that car.
The one thing great about the Viper was that it was the one car faster than the Vette with more power and aggressive looks. Theres no question that through the entire 90s the Viper was the superior car. However since the introduction of the C6 Z06 that just hasnt been the case. The Vette has been getting better while the styling of the Viper has gotten worse not to mention the power has stayed the same and the brakes and handling is crude at best. Yes of course theres the ACR but at what cost, 110k? At that price its in a different range and in ZR1range. Theres too much of a gap between the two and Dodge doesnt have the money to dump into a low production supercar to really make it the Vette Killer its always been.
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Personally, I always thought that having the goal of the Viper to be a "Vette killer" was aiming a little low...
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Well think of it like this being one of the big 3 you come out with a 60k plus car thats a sportscar with crazy hp numbers. It doesn't matter if your intention is to compete with the Vette or not, it will happen. The Corvette is the measuring stick of American performance in the 50k and up catogory. Its been that way for 50 some years. If you expect to sell cars in that segment the Vette is the car that you have to beat.
1989 Turbo Trans Am #82, 2007 Cobalt SS G85
Jookycola wrote:Vipers suck.
Corvette or nothing
all the way!!
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