Well to me acrylic enamel is pretty junk to put on cars. Even if your goign for a oem look or a show quality look deltron 2000 would be used if i were going to paint your car. I found a friend of mine asking me about paint and saying he went to a shop and they wanted to paint his hotrod with acrylic enamel after he put 14k into it. The guy claims he has been doing business for 30 years then why would he not of upgraded ages ago with the new technology.
Positive using base clear
Paint will last longer
Wont flake
Will not fade in UV light
Easier to blend in
Positives using acrylic enamel
Doesnt use a clear
Mix up hardner with base and shoot on car, no buffing afterwards
Cheaper
*acrylic is less durable in my opinion. I have been doing body work now for about 3 years and the shop i use to help never used a acrylic enamel. I just cant believe somebody would want to put that on there car just to save a few bucks.
I wanted to get this thread goign so people interested in painting there cars and goes to body shops for quotes they will know exactly what there talking about.
Please post your feelings and opinions on the single stage vs base clear.
single stage = better looking primer
lol thats basically the only reason i used it in black on things i added.. looked better then black primer..and was just as cheap
some just use single stage say if they are going to sell the car to make it look more presentable.. not everyone who owns a car is in for that show shine and think their paintjob is a big deal.. some just want it to look painted..
Except for being less expensive it is difficult to understand why anyone would shoot acrylic enamel today. The surface is more brittle, orange peel and weathering are problems and resistance to fade is poor. Even with a hardener, acrylic enamel is not a good choice.
A compromise finish is single-stage urethane which is less expensive, easier to apply and does not have the high gloss characteristic of base/clear but will flex well and retain its gloss. Some car owners prefer the softer gloss of single-stage urethane to the high gloss of base /clear.
Tonight i just bought a oem qaurt of deltron 2000 for $170. I could of got though acrylic for $70. I shot the rest of my car though with the oem base clear so im finishing like that too. Oem corvette red just isnt cheap at all but neither is any red period. I guess i would rather spend the money on paint because it is what makes a car look good. Im not sure why anyone would not want to put clear coat on there car. There are just so many reasons to have clear such as wetsand it after paint clear and buff it out really good. I started wetsanding my main body with 1500-2000-2500 grit and this weekend im going to buff it out. I just picked up a quart to reshoot my front bumper, hood and trunk lid. I guess its like everything else, you get what you pay for when it comes to paint.
Single stage is only good if you want to repaint a car before selling it and don't give a crap that it's going to look like poo in a few years for the new owner.
I'd never use single stage on a car of mine...
Single stage is also used when restoring a car to original condition. Although I would never do it people do to keep the authenticity.
Re: Single-stage urethane paint
In 1981, I sandblasted, acid treated, phosphated, bondoed and puttied the rusted frame of my 68 Chevelle convertible. I applied an epoxy primer followed by two coats of black Dupont Imron, a two-part single-stage urethane paint that is still popular today in industrial applications. That paint still shines just as it did 15 years ago when it was applied. It has not crazed, buckled or peeled. At that time, OEM paint was much more primitive than it is today and many hot rodders were using Imron urethane as a color topcoat with great and long lasting success.
If anything, today's single-stage urethanes are superior to 40 year, legendary old school Imron for automotive use.
Jack
Single stage = Maaco
Although I had my car painted in base/clear at a Maaco... but it cost me a wee bit more than the cheap lacquer paint... it's minty tho, dontcha think? (See my sig?)
Maby you could give a little definition or some insight in to the difference between single stage and base clear paints, i dont know the difference and would love too.
Thanks.
98 j-body sedan
I might not be fully correct, but single stage paint is an enamel paint with the base and clear mixed together. A lot of people use single-stage paint just to be cheap and don't really know or care what the car will look like when it comes to quality. Base/Clear paint jobs is when the shop paints the car with the paint first and then the clear. The Base/Clear paint is pretty much what our cars come with from the factory. Single-stage paint chips easy, flakes, and fades within a few years after getting done.
Correct me if I'm wrong guys
Awesome i understand now.
so when we even paint say our interior pieces and we hit them with a spray bomb, that would be the base, then we clear it that would be your clear,lol, so that would be a base/clear.
98 j-body sedan
There is a very substantial difference between any acrylic enamel and single-stage urethanes. i.e. Imron
So acrylic enamel and single-stage are different? exsplain please i wont to know
so are there three types, acrylic enamel, single stage, and base/clear; are these different methods of painnting, or types of paintting or what; please clear me up on this,lol
Thanks
98 j-body sedan
These are three types of paint with progressive quality, longevity and gloss. In general, the methods of painting are similar. There is no doubt that base/clear is the best for quality but most difficult to apply and most expensive.
And, for real old schoolers there once was acrylic laquer which produced high gloss and was easy to spray, sand and buff, but cracked over time. It was caught in the EPA radar and is usually unavailable today.
Clean air standards have forced many modifications in paint and application for those who play by the rules.
So i am still confused, lol....., is it just the two types of methods to applying paint? base/clear, and single stage where your paint/base and clear are mixed into one..?????????
Thanks
98 j-body sedan
Yes, single stage or bc/cc are the methods of painting. Acrylic enamels, laquers, urethanes, polyurethanes, etc, etc..... are diffrent chemical types of resins that create paints. Single-stage paints have the paint and clear resin sorta intermixed... not really but it would take a chalkboard and a calculator to explain. Base coat/clear coat is basically the same resin.... same resin, but the base coat has solids in it... I.E. the color paint. The clear coat is basically like the name says... a resin without solids in it... I.E. no paint color. A clear paint. Bascoat/Clear coat is more expensive to do... due to the extra stages involved in painting and buffing, but it is worth it. Todays urethanes are very strong and flexible. The clear has UV protectors in it to help retain the color or the base coat. It is also good because the clear adds a protective coating over your paint. So, light scratches can be buffed out as opposed to a paint and blend job on the single stages. Base coat/clear coat is also great for adding graphics, like flames or tribals for example, and then clear them to seal them. The single stage paint system have been around since the 60's and they are good if done right. You can buff them to shine, but not like BC/CC. I always thought of bc/cc like putting a really pretty picture you love in a picture holder. Take a piece of metal that you painted with rattlecan or anything painted, then put it behind a piece of polished glass and you can really tell a diffrence. Most paint systems are now BC/CC so I would recommend them, unless your just painting due to finacial or quick sell. I have to admit I have seen some single-stage paint jobs that were damn near close to BC/CC jobs. It's all in the painter, I suppose.
The world is a beautiful place.... but I wouldn't want to paint it.
Oh, I forgot to add... metallics are a nightmare on single stages.... you have to be really good to lay down on of those.... usually end up molting or tigerstripping....nasty looking. That's why most custom paint jobs are bc/cc. Candies, pearls, metalics, graphics (mostly) bc/cc..
The world is a beautiful place.... but I wouldn't want to paint it.
Outlaw Star wrote:Yes, single stage or bc/cc are the methods of painting. Acrylic enamels, laquers, urethanes, polyurethanes, etc, etc..... are diffrent chemical types of resins that create paints. Single-stage paints have the paint and clear resin sorta intermixed... not really but it would take a chalkboard and a calculator to explain. Base coat/clear coat is basically the same resin.... same resin, but the base coat has solids in it... I.E. the color paint. The clear coat is basically like the name says... a resin without solids in it... I.E. no paint color. A clear paint. Bascoat/Clear coat is more expensive to do... due to the extra stages involved in painting and buffing, but it is worth it. Todays urethanes are very strong and flexible. The clear has UV protectors in it to help retain the color or the base coat. It is also good because the clear adds a protective coating over your paint. So, light scratches can be buffed out as opposed to a paint and blend job on the single stages. Base coat/clear coat is also great for adding graphics, like flames or tribals for example, and then clear them to seal them. The single stage paint system have been around since the 60's and they are good if done right. You can buff them to shine, but not like BC/CC. I always thought of bc/cc like putting a really pretty picture you love in a picture holder. Take a piece of metal that you painted with rattlecan or anything painted, then put it behind a piece of polished glass and you can really tell a diffrence. Most paint systems are now BC/CC so I would recommend them, unless your just painting due to finacial or quick sell. I have to admit I have seen some single-stage paint jobs that were damn near close to BC/CC jobs. It's all in the painter, I suppose.
Great, great, great, work!! Awesome write up. I can't wait to get my car out the shop tomorrow. BC/CC ftw
Yes thanks very much man, awesome write up; much more clear to me now; good job, appreciate the help......
98 j-body sedan
