Hey guys. Ive searched this and altho I found some information, and general knowledge i just wanted to ask more questions. I did some work on my car, and it required me to repaint the whole front clip (fenders, hood, bumper), ive also got sideskirts and a rear bumper too paint too, but this is most important since without it, I cant drive the car so its a work in progress. Now, I have everything painted BUT the orange peel is horrible, and even tho I layed down two coats of clear, its still got very little shine. Now im not a painter by any means but I want the satisfaction of doing it myself, plus the paint is not costly to myself. Now, i do have a HVLP gun I bought just for this. One thing I think im having the most problem is setting the guns settings right. I think I had it with too much paint, not enough air, but its a learning process. Now, the hood came out horribly, the paint lifted in places, and IDK why bc i prepped that just as good as I did everything else. So that is gonna get re-done later. But the bumper and fenders just have a TON of orange peel. Now my questions. I keep seeing ppl say wetsand the color. Do i put any rubbing compound on it?? Then, after im done wetsanding the color, if I dont put any compound on it, it leaves a foggy look to it, do I just lay the clear down over that??? Now, after that, and I let it sit for a few hours (I let my fenders and bumper sit for over 8 hours bc I shot them before I went to work, then re installed them onto the car when i got home) and I wetsand it again, using 2000 grit 3m sandpaper, again, it leaves the foggy look. I have 3M Rubbing compound and when I use that (all by hand and I only have a orbital buffer since I really never used a high speed buffer and Im worried that ill mess it up) it still leaves a slight foggy look. I also used Meguiers (SP?) Swirl Mark Remover, and noticed that with that combo it removes about 95% of the foggyness. What am I doing wrong?? I mean dont get me wrong, the stuff looks 100 times better then when I got the stuff, so Im actually pretty happy but one fender has some zebra stripes so im gonna redo it, So since im redoing that, should i just wetsand it smooth, hit it with color again (I have not wetsanded it at all so there is no wax or anything on it, but just incase ill rub it down with rubbing alcohol) then let that sit, then hit it with clear coat or two, then wetsand and do the pre-mentioned combo?? Thanks guys, I just want this to turn out alot better. Altho for my truely first time painting, I dont think it came out too bad. Just not professional by any means. Thanks guys. I would love to have a deep shine paint job, but im sure that wont happen, so If I can get this to look better it would be a good thing.

Ok next time use paragraphs please Now I only read about half of that and I really just want to say stop trying. But then again you won't learn. There is a reason why people go to school for this kind of stuff. It's not like you can pick up a paint gun and have no problems the first time... I would cut your loss and just take it to a shop.

Now if your stubborn I'll give you a few tips...
1. Paint gun setup. The objective here is to get a nice fan pattern. I always set up the size of fan pattern first before messing with the other settings. You said you have problems with too much paint coming out. That's an easy fix. Adjust the knob that lines directly up with the nossel what this does is control the fluid by stopping the trigger at a certain spot that you set. It's important to set it up for the normal amount of material you want being applied. The reason for this is because you can then pull the trigger all the way back and know your putting the same amount on evenly. Once that is all done you can adjust your air pressure. Always adjust that last because if you alter the fan pattern at all the psi changes.

2. For tiger stripes. They are easy to avoid. Just make sure you are doing a 50% over lap from top to bottom. If it still occurs you can do a 75% overlap but just realize it uses more material.

3. When you setup your air pressure make sure it's not too high. The higher the air pressure the more over spray there is and the more material there is being wasted. I always set mine up to be as low as possible . Now when I say that I mean it still has enough pressure to atomize the paint and get it on the panel in a uniform way. Always do a test sheet when setting up your gun and when you do check your edges for a nice faded look. If the edges look blotchy turn up your air pressure a tad.

4. You do not need to wetsand color unless you mess up or let it sit too long. now if you wetsand it, it will leave sand scratches in it so it is needed to apply another coat of base before the clear. Also don't use rubbing compound on the base coat



http://nwgme.org

One other thing. The base coat without clear is suppose to look foggy or dull. What happens there is the reducer evaporates. The clear coat is what gives it shine.



http://nwgme.org

Bhirst: Thanks man. I know nobody picks up a gun and is perfect the first time. Im fully aware of this, hence why I spent 1000.00's of dollars learning to work on cars, but this I wanna learn, and If I mess it up, then oh well, its my car and at least im doing this with a actual gun and real paint and not rattle can or worse, paint brush. Worst case senario, I send it to a shop and have it re-done but at least I can say i tried. So i guess it makes me stubborn I just wanna give it a try. Its a learning experience for me, and I wanna at least give it a shot, but thanks for the info. Really. I do appreciate it. Now I have my gun set at 20-22PSI on the regulator directly at the bottom of the gun. I never thought about that adjuster at the back of the gun (I thought it was to lock it from spraying, my mistake). The paint came out rough. Seems like it was spraying to much. So im gonna try and dial that down a bit. I know there is a sweet spot on the gun, I just have yet to find it.

The zebra stripes I know were nothing but my fault, I just didnt see them until it was in sunlight. Those I know I need to overlap to prevent. So I know I had it right since nothing else had it, expect that one panel, so I know I can fix that.

The orange peel and lack of shine is the only real issue. I know no base coat gives a shine and thats what the clear is for. But even with the clear down its still got a dull sort of look to it. But im assuming it has to do with the in-correct setting on the gun. Ill just have to play with it more to get it down.

Im sure with time (as everything else) Ill get better. Altho Ill never take this on as a job. I just wanna be able to do my own car. So I wanna learn this as much as possible. But again, thanks for the help, and ill make sure ill just play with the gun a little more. I should be redoing the panel and hood next weekend. Maybe with ur tips it will come out better. Thanks again, and keep the ideas coming in!!

EDIT: I know some ppl may come in here and think im a idiot, but im trying to do this the right way, again, its not gonna be professional, but I wanna do it. And the paint really does not cost me much (the perks of working for a major parts outlet and getting this at cost ) So please, If you have tips, Like Bhirst did, please share them. Im not a @!#$ nor am I a idiot. I just wanna try this and see if I can do it. At least im not rattle canning it, or painting it a paint brush like other posts we have seen. Thanks for everyone who give me hints and tips.


Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Wednesday, August 04, 2010 2:24 AM

Very good advice from Bhirst. Atomization is key for a good paint job, so definitely play around with your gun a bit and learn how adjusting your air pressure and fluid ratio effect how the paint sprays and lays. You want to just right fluid to air ratio, and as Bhirst said, air pressure is a key point. When I do my set up sprays on a test panel, I make one solid pass from side to side, then by looking at how the paint sprayed, I can adjust my settings accordingly. You're looking for a nice fade on the edges, no heavy spots or blotching, no runs, etc...
I also use an in line air regulator at the base of the gun, so I'll set my air pressure a bit higher at the compressor, then bump it down at the regulator. Also keep in mind things like the size of the fluid tip will effect what you are spraying, as well as the atmosphere you are spraying in. How dry/humid the air is, and the temperature will effect how the paint reacts.

A lot of learning how to paint is just trial and error, and practice. You seem to have the right idea on things, I think it's going to be a matter of just experimenting with your gun's settings til you get more familiar with it, and you will progress from there.

Evil, thanks man. At least you see that im trying to learn and do this right, and not just saying give it up, and leaving it at that. Yeah, when I shot the stuff, it was really dry and humid. So that was prolly a factor, as you said. Like I said, im gonna reshoot this stuff next weekend bc then Ill have the WHOLE weekend to play around and see what I can do. I also have some old parts that I can play with and practice on, so im gonna do that too. Paint doesnt cost me more then 11 bucks a quart so its not really a big deal if it gets a little wasted. But yeah, thanks man. Im just trying here. I was hoping to find someone out here in Chicago that could HELP me with it. I dont really want anyone to do it for me, I just wanted some help bc you learn by doing. Ya know. And the closest thing I got was someone wanting to charge me 500. For that I could take it to the body shop and have them spray it for me. But it takes the fun outta being able to mod my car. I like being able to say "yep, I did it all myself, with help of course". But idk maybe thats just a me thing . but thanks again, and keep the ideas coming. The more the better. Im not asking someone to give me all there knowledge, bc I know it wont happen, just tips and tricks is all im looking for and Im sure with pratice ill get better each time. Thanks again guys!!!!

Mike Z A.K.A SNEEZY wrote:Paint doesnt cost me more then 11 bucks a quart so its not really a big deal if it gets a little wasted.

Wow you need to hook me up with your paint supplier! lol

Quote:

I was hoping to find someone out here in Chicago that could HELP me with it.

Wanna drive to PA? I'll give you a crash course, lol...just bring some me some $11 quarts and we'll call it even!


Also forgot to ask, what kind of paint are you using (as far as brand)? Different paints are formulated differently, and therefore will spray different. In example, Dupont Centari is a slightly thicker paint, I guess what I would think of as a normal acrylic enamel consistency, while Nasson is much much thinner, almost like working with a water based paint. A thinner paint will obviously spray out a little smoother by default, though you then have to watch out for it running easily if you are heavy handed or make slower passes.
You can also play around with the mix ratio of the paint, for example, the Centari is a 4:1:2 mix (if I remember correctly) if you are using hardener, but depending on what conditions I'm spraying in, I may adjust that a little. I find that lately it's been about a constant 78 degrees where I am spraying stuff at home, which is a little lower than Centari likes, so I over reduce just a little bit.

Well, the paint im using isnt nothing special. Its the Dupli-color Paint Shop paint. They sell it at our stores, and the normal price is 25 per quart. Its not prefessional paint by any means, but its easier to work with when you follow the directions, and you dont need to thin it out. So again, easier to work with. And I have seen cars painted with it, and it does come out really nice. IF you know what your doing. Which in this case, I dont, and since its so in-expensive for me to get, its not bad, and I would rather work with that for now, learn all I can with that, then go from there, and get the better stuff. So thats why my paint isnt expensive at all.

I sprayed everything Monday mourning, so I would say it was about 85-90 degrees so it was really hot, and humid as hell. But the first quart of paint I got was bad. When I picked up another quart, it was good, and I still have some left. Altho I ordered another can, as a just incase. Im glad this paint does not require any thinning, and according to Duplicolor, just stir it up, pour through the strainer, and adjust the gun, and spray. Sounds simple enough, obviously its not . I also found out it is a Lacquer base paint. I guess it wont hold up over time, But when I get comfortable with painting then Ill redo it. Until then Ill use this stuff, if it messes up, im out what 12 bucks, not 2-300. Thats one MAJOR reason im usung this stuff. I know nobody will agree with me, but I would rather spend 100 bucks now on this stuff, and learn, instead of 200 to 300 and mess that up. To me it makes sense . But yeah, thats prolly a a reason its not laying out smooth. But oh well, again, this is ALL a learning experience for me. But thanks for the help man, and I do appreciate it. Oh, and Please dont hound me about the paint, i know its cheap as hell, but as I said, I would rather learn with this stuff, VS learning with the expensive stuff and messing ut up and being out a ton more money. Thanks again.

Definitely good to learn with cheaper stuff, that's the right idea..and yes, Dupli-Color Paint Shop is a lacquer base, and lacquer does react differently than acrylic enamel (or for the sake of argument, urethane base). I would suggest grabbing some cheap acrylic enamel to work with, to give you a better feel of working with it. Most local auto body supply places that carry paint will have Dupont Centari, which your basic colors are usually $25-30 per quart, a few bucks for hardner, and grab some generic reducer at walmart for like $10...just a suggestion.

Also when you prep, are you wiping down with prep solv and a tack cloth immediately before spraying? You'd be surprised how much fine dust a tack cloth pulls up that you don't even see on the panel with your eye.

The urethane base is gonna be next. I wanna get this down first before i go any deeper. If i fewl cobdiset enough the ill go the other route. But thanks for the heads up. I really wanna learn this but ill prolly go that route later on. But again thanks. And yea I'm wiping it down just before paint. Not with a tack cloth but I did wipe it with alcohol liberally and it was nice and clean. I also sprayed the floor down before i even put parts inside. but I get the tack cloth next time before I spray definitely. Again ty Evil.

I hope you mean moving onto acrylic enamel...not urethane. Urethane can be EXTREMELY harmful when sprayed in open air, its meant to be used in specially designed "down draft" paint booths, and only with a fresh air supply mask. Your typical charcoal respirator will not filter out the harmful fumes in urethane and can leave you with urethane poisoning (which I'm told leaves a firery burning in your lungs and gut for several weeks) and can easily kill any small animals/children in the nearby area.
Places like Eastwood sell this stuff, and do not clearly identify the proper conditions in which to use it. For spraying at home (or anywhere that isn't a paint booth) acrylic enamel will be your best friend. I highly recommend dupont products, especially the Centari line (even though the color availability is sliming due to heavier goverment VOC regulations that are starting to filter down), and Nasson is another good brand to work with...both are relatively cheap, and I like working with both.

Yeah, I ment that, I mis-read ur post lol. Sorry. I did mean the acrylic enamel, hahah. But again Evil, thanks alot. If ur ever down in Chicago, I owe u a beer, or 4 lol.

Mike Z A.K.A SNEEZY wrote:Yeah, I ment that, I mis-read ur post lol. Sorry. I did mean the acrylic enamel, hahah. But again Evil, thanks alot. If ur ever down in Chicago, I owe u a beer, or 4 lol.

Lol, well it just happens that I love beer, so I'll keep that in mind!

Hahaha, If you do ever come out, help me with my car, screw it, Ill take you downtown to a nice ass nightclub, buy for u all night, then before you leave, buy u another case or two hahahahaha.

Mike Z A.K.A SNEEZY wrote:Hahaha, If you do ever come out, help me with my car, screw it, Ill take you downtown to a nice ass nightclub, buy for u all night, then before you leave, buy u another case or two hahahahaha.

Sounds like I need to visit Chicago! lol

Ha, sounds like its about time lol

Hey Evil. I was wondering. I saw the car tonight under bright ass lights, and noticed it didnt look that great still. So I was wondering, If I wet sanded all the parts down, and laid another coat or two of clear (after I play with the gun to get it to lay smoother) do you think it will help, or will it still have that foggy effect?? Thanks again man. I just saw really well that the side I wet sanded altho alot smoother, still has the cloudy look to it. I know Its because Im not using a high speed buffer and great rubbing compound, but im hoping if I wetsand and then a new coat or two of clear will bring the sine out. Thanks man!