Read the crayon, the last 3 chapters\books are pretty aggressive...


Chris




"An appeal to arms and the God of hosts is all that is left us. But we shall not fight our battle alone. There is a just God that presides over the destinies of nations. The battle sir, is not of the strong alone. Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it almighty God. I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death."

Speech at the Second Virginia Convention at St. John's Church in Richmond, Virginia (23 March 1775) Patrick Henry

My crayon says RoseArt cuz I'm to cheap for Crauola

20/20 Special Islam: Questions and Answers
20/20 Video parts 1,2 & 3
what I seen between Blue Bloods commercial breaks seemed kind of interesting.

I watched the video "Three Things About Islam", but not the ABC show.

I don't know if the questions brought up in the video are answered in the ABC show.
What I can say is that the video contains many false accusations towards Islam, and that I can personally answer many of the points brought up in the video, and with a bit of research, can answer the rest of them.

I see the video as a sad use of media and tone to not only address the simple-minded person who doesn't know much about the topic, but also to target those who consider themselves more sophisticated in order to convince them.

The video only looks truly informative, but it is deceptive and untrue. This is very unfortunate. Not one source or reference was stated, nor was any of the accusations backed.

I stand by for questions. I will answer them to the best of my capabilities, to let you know the true face of Islam, and so that maybe one day, you may stop believing The Media as much as you do now.

I'm also open for dialog beyond this forum, such as instant messenger, etc.

Your fellow Muslim J-Body owner

PS. I will only accept academic inquiries and discussions. I will not tolerate any bashing or insulting, as I've already suffered enough from it. Thank you.

^^^ Cool and to defender the guy below please don't be a jerk .



Edited 2 time(s). Last edited Sunday, October 03, 2010 5:49 PM

Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved Acts 16:31

Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.
" Mark Twain "

But how can i believe anything you say, when it is supposedly permitted by your holy book, to decieve infidels such as myself?

.


“Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet you invented. Oh, oh, the irony!” -Jon Stewart

Spike J wrote:20/20 Special Islam: Questions and Answers
20/20 Video parts 1,2 & 3
what I seen between Blue Bloods commercial breaks seemed kind of interesting.

How dare you bring something that some people here don't want to hear. As long as you bring facts that just doesn't coincide with their bigotry, all you're doing is pissing against the wind these retrograde people.

What's ironic the first 0:36 of Infi's first vid, it can be said about any religion in general.
At 1:43 speaks on Qur'an is meant to be taken literally, and the Torah and Christian and Catholics are not? These latter folks that goes to worship on their holy day are there to just pass the time, instead of getting instructed on how to live life?
#2 and spreading Shari'a across the world, sound like our US foreign policy and input American style democracy and values on nations that have no idea of it and have been doing their own thing for centuries. Sorry Shari'a, but the US has you beat on that one.
#3 Taqiyya sounds familiar on the lie on where the bible says the woman came out of Adam's rib... known as Eve. Here Christians are deceiving Christian to help Christianity on the belief on where certain people came about. And stories on deceptiveness are a dime a dozen in ANY religious book, especially the bible.

Moral of this post... religion is the culprit of crap wars we (humans) go with around the world and through out history. It is the misinterpretations and the extremism that starts it. Today, the "in" thing is to go after the muslims because certain political figure heads are telling their sheep half truths in order instill hatred on a religion we really have no business with other then that they carry and commodity that we want as a national interest.


THE POLITICALLY INCORRECT ONE.

Bonus: If I am a self-styled atheist, it nets me bonus points when I have a wine cork sniffing party with my designer sweater friends!

.


“Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet you invented. Oh, oh, the irony!” -Jon Stewart

Trying to use reason and logic to convince the haters of Islam that they've been misled is no different than trying to convert KKK members or neo-Nazis. They don't want to hear it, they will not respond to it, and they are driven only by the hatred they share with their counterparts. They'd rather attempt to gang-rape the public's sensibilities than stand back and reflect on the big picture.

Fortunately for the human race, the majority will not buy into it. Even more encouragingly, as time goes on, less and less engage in this type of institutionalized hatred. The tide IS turning. Thank (insert preferred deity's name here).

Take Back the Republican Party wrote:Trying to use reason and logic to convince the haters of Islam that they've been misled is no different than trying to convert KKK members or neo-Nazis. They don't want to hear it, they will not respond to it, and they are driven only by the hatred they share with their counterparts. They'd rather attempt to gang-rape the public's sensibilities than stand back and reflect on the big picture.

Fortunately for the human race, the majority will not buy into it. Even more encouragingly, as time goes on, less and less engage in this type of institutionalized hatred. The tide IS turning. Thank (BOB).

There i fixed it. put my gods name in there.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/sndsgood/ https://www.facebook.com/#!/Square1Photography

Quote:

But how can i believe anything you say, when it is supposedly permitted by your holy book, to decieve infidels such as myself?

Let me point out that the video did not reference any of the stated facts. It just presented them in a seemingly academic manner. If any topic, let alone religion, were to be discussed in an academic environment, this video and what was said in it would have no value at all, because there are no references.

Anyway, I'm sure you notice I'm not taking this the whole way. I could elaborate much more. But, I'm not in the mood, really. I'm just pointing out the things that will help you think it out yourself.

Hassoun, so you are saying the statements about deceiving infidels being ok.......you are saying that they were lies, or just that he didn't give references from the queeran.?


“Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet you invented. Oh, oh, the irony!” -Jon Stewart

It's quran or koran idiot ^^^ Quit being a dick .


Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved Acts 16:31

Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.
" Mark Twain "

I'm saying both the points that you mentioned, and many more. Anti-Islam campaigners love to take verses out of context and build up their accusations upon them.
Basically
1- The discussion in the video is worthless because of its lack of academic stance. If you went to a university level trying to disprove Islam (or any other topic) this way, you wouldn't even be considered.
2- Even if verses were quoted from the Quran, it doesn't mean that the information is true. It is just the statement of their arguments against Islam. Then it would be the turn of the one defending Islam to bring his own arguments and properly reference them to make his point or refute the accusations. And this would go on till one side would completely disprove the other.

Also, what I'm saying is that you have a brain. This brain of yours is capable of being put to great use. Don't let anyone come and feed you information and make you believe that you're being informed. Use your brain; use your logic.

There is a wonderful and thorough lecture in English by a Muslim speaker in response to the Dove World Outreach Center and its intention of burning the Quran (which you might have heard in recent news) and in response to their religious leader accusing Islam to be a Satanic religion. I can find the lecture if you want.

"Hassoun",

Quote:

1- The discussion in the video is worthless because of its lack of academic stance. If you went to a university level trying to disprove Islam (or any other topic) this way, you wouldn't even be considered.

2- Even if verses were quoted from the Quran, it doesn't mean that the information is true. It is just the statement of their arguments against Islam.

Quote:

Then it would be the turn of the one defending Islam to bring his own arguments and properly reference them to make his point or refute the accusations. And this would go on till one side would completely disprove the other.

1a) Just for kicks and giggles, lets just say that i don't read or speak Arabic, and am asking you to deny that the Q'ran permits deceiving infidels as long as it furthers that cause of Islam. Just say that the Q'ran doesn't say that.

2b) Since I have been deceived by the video it seems then...

Quote:

Then it would be the turn of the one defending Islam to bring his own arguments and properly reference them to make his point or refute the accusations.

.

Finally, and I'd like an answer to this one especially: Is the English or any other non-arabic translation of the Q'ran considered equally reliable as a legitimate text as the arabic version? And I mean, would your local Imam or Cleric hold to that stance?

Quote:

I stand by for questions. I will answer them to the best of my capabilities, to let you know the true face of Islam, and so that maybe one day, you may stop believing The Media as much as you do now.

please don't try your best to answer the questions, or "to the best of your knowledge" please answer them yes or no....or lacking that, a straightforward answer.
.


“Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet you invented. Oh, oh, the irony!” -Jon Stewart

Thank you, Hassoun, for presenting a reasoned and logical perspective. You appear to understand very well how anti-Islamics are mostly using terrorist tactics to deliver their message. We appreciate your willingness to speak without invective or vindictiveness. You have my admiration.

Thank you TBTRP.

I deny the accusations in the video, including the one about deceiving non-Muslims in the way it was presented.
The Arabic word for what they are referring to is "Taqiyah" which means dissimulation. This is done when one's life is in danger, or in extreme circumstances. And it only goes to the extent of hiding one's true faith. Let's say a Muslim is caught by a gang who hate Muslims. In that case, the Muslim can hide his true belief in order to save himself. That is the "deception" that is mentioned in the video. (There are more details to the topic, but this is what I have at the tip of my fingers, or should I say at the top of my head, at the moment)

As for taking the translations of the Quran, only the Arabic Quran is the true, perfect, untouched and unmodified Holy Book. To feed your curiosity, you can look up English translations by different authors, ex. Yusuf Ali, Pickthall, etc. See this Wikipedia page. Scroll down until you find the blue box on the right side. You will read about 31 different translations of the same verse by different authors over different periods of time.

You will see that the translations slightly vary in meaning over time. You may even notice a certain agenda behind the translations if you compare them to the political atmosphere of the time, and the country of the author.

Translations of the Quran enable an approximate meaning to be transmitted, and you would have to read more translations to get closer to the actual meaning in Arabic.
That is why only the original Arabic version of the Quran is taken to be the perfect truth.

I know its wikipedia, but here is what wiki has to say about Taqiyah:

Taqiyah (cap)
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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For teaching on concealment in some Islamic sects, see Taqiyya.

Various takiyah on display in Pettah market, Colombo, Sri Lanka.

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The taqiyah, also spelled tagiyah, is a short, rounded cap worn by Muslim men. When worn by itself, the taqiyah can be any color. When worn under the keffiyah scarf, it is always white. Some Muslims wrap the turban around the cap. The turban is called an imama in Arabic. A hadith in the books of Abu Dawud and Tirmidhi quotes Prophet Muhammad as saying, "The distinction between us and the polytheists is the caps over our turbans." Today the taqiyah still serves, amongst other things, as a form of religious uniform, to identify oneself to the rest of the world as somebody who adheres to Islam.

In the United States and Britain, many Muslim merchants sell the prayer cap under the name kufi.

Muslims wear the taqiyah to emulate Muhammad. The companions of Muhammad were never seen without their heads being covered. In order to emulate their actions, Muslims throughout the world wear a variety of taqiyat, fez hats, and other headgear. Another goal of wearing a taqiyah is to be more like Muhammad and therefore obey and follow his tradition.

The taqiyah is actually a tradition from antiquity; pre-Islamic Arabs had the habit of always wearing something on their heads. They considered it inappropriate not to wear headgear like the keffiyeh, see Sartorial hijab for further information.

The taqiyah is also called a prayer cap in English. Many Muslims wear the taqiyah during Jumu'ah, or Friday prayers at the mosque, and during daily salat, or prayers at home. For men, it is mustahab, which means "praise worthy" or "seeking the love of God", to cover the head during prayer. Some Muslims use a prayer mat during salat. It is common for men to wear a taqiyah during weddings (see Nikah).




its a damn hat.
.


“Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet you invented. Oh, oh, the irony!” -Jon Stewart

Here's a good reference book for those of you interested about what Islam truly is and says. Written by two brothers...former muslims.

Unveiling Islam

http://www.amazon.com/Unveiling-Islam-Insiders-Muslim-Beliefs/dp/0825424283/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1286758273&sr=8-1

Of course, "Hassoun", you would consider them heretics and in "the old country" they would have been put to death for converting from Islam. No?

.


“Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet you invented. Oh, oh, the irony!” -Jon Stewart

INFIDEL wrote:

Read the crayon, the last 3 chapters\books are pretty aggressive...


Chris

so...they don't like Americasns and want to kill Americans and infidels, I think we all know that.

This is the taqiyya I am referring to.

And no Kevin, Islam does not dictate us to put to death anyone who leaves the Islamic faith.

I feel like I've been posting almost uselessly, all this time here. I've been answering the questions you're asking, but it seems you're going back to square one.

Here is a lecture clarifying Islam's point of view regarding killing infidels (each part is about an hour, you can listen to it while working):
Part 1 (he starts the lecture with a few prayers in Arabic for ~30 seconds, followed by the English lecture)
Part 2 (also starts with a few Arabic prayers for a few seconds)

Hassoun, those whose hatred is imbued in their souls, hearts and minds will be most resistant to new information. They do not wish to believe it, and as such, their lack of a well-rounded perspective utterly prevents them from seeing these other points of view. It logically follows that this inflexibility, this very limited purview, is what got them thinking so hatefully in the first place.

You've not wasted your time, for many others read this and can understand the points you make. Thankfully, the true haters are an extreme minority.

For an inspirational and shocking look into how embedded hatred can ruin lives, and how much it truly takes to rescue a devout hater from his demons, I heartily recommend that everyone see the movie American History X. I still maintain Edward Norton should have received the Best Actor Oscar for his moving performance.




Edited 1 time(s). Last edited Tuesday, October 12, 2010 9:45 PM

Hassoun wrote:This is the taqiyya I am referring to.

And no Kevin, Islam does not dictate us to put to death anyone who leaves the Islamic faith.

I feel like I've been posting almost uselessly, all this time here. I've been answering the questions you're asking, but it seems you're going back to square one.

Here is a lecture clarifying Islam's point of view regarding killing infidels (each part is about an hour, you can listen to it while working):
Part 1 (he starts the lecture with a few prayers in Arabic for ~30 seconds, followed by the English lecture)
Part 2 (also starts with a few Arabic prayers for a few seconds)

Square one...

Who Invaded who around....say....450 AD (in the middle east)?
And I dont mean the trip from medina to mecca.

The Jew's?
The Christians?
Or the hojies (islams)?

Chris





"An appeal to arms and the God of hosts is all that is left us. But we shall not fight our battle alone. There is a just God that presides over the destinies of nations. The battle sir, is not of the strong alone. Is life so dear or peace so sweet as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it almighty God. I know not what course others may take, but as for me, give me liberty, or give me death."

Speech at the Second Virginia Convention at St. John's Church in Richmond, Virginia (23 March 1775) Patrick Henry

oh god...here we go with the crusades again.... The pope of rome called upon europe's kings to reclaim the holy land in the name of the church. Invasions and massacres ensued. Europeans raped burned and pillaged. Muslims drove out and murdered christians living in jerusaelm. Both the warrior prophet (mohammed) and the european kings were guilty of atrocities and mass murders in the name of their respective religions. And that's the end of the crusades. No one today seriously gives a rats behind about them. The issue is....today, and how people are behaving today.

Bringing up crusades is like blaming white people for slavery in America. no one alive today owned a slave, and therefore is not responsible for the wrong. Ottoman turks butchered over 2 million Armenian Christans in the early 20th century. Blaming today's government or its citizens is a waste of time. The fact the the turkish muzzies refuse to admit it, is another thing though.

.


“Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet you invented. Oh, oh, the irony!” -Jon Stewart

^^^ Go Tell that to a black person; go up to him and say, "I owe you nothing. That slavery thing, well, eat my anus, because my people don't owe your people shif." Then call him Nigger. See what happens.

Do it. I dare you.