Hey I just got on here and was looking to buy a cavy 2ng gen. But what seems to be the popular motor is 2.2 ecotec. which I dont understand b/c the z24 is the performance engine and the 95 z24 has the quad 4 which is what I heard supposed to be the best engine to use if you want the best performancefrom a cavy. which is why I want to buy a z24 cavy. I want to mod it up the ying yang and get all I can out of it while keeping it streetable b/c it will be daily. So any advice would be very helpful.
buy a Z24 with a Twin Cam......lose 10 horsepower and gain a good engine...not a POS. my grandpa works at GM and thats been the most common motor that they get in being blow and what not for like 4 years now.....
FOR SALE: (5) '95-'99 Z24 Rims
ok I'm guessing you mean the 96 and up z's b/c I thought all z24's were dohc
The Twin Cam is different from the Quad 4. The quad 4 was a 2.3 and the HO motor made 180 HP I think and the LO motor made 160??
So yes when referring to twin cam he means all z24 motors from 96-2002.
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Madjack wrote:Like I said before, building an engine like ours (2.2 or 2200) is a painstaking chore , since there is so few custom made parts. It's frustrating to me too, but that's what I like about doing this engine, it's the challenge.
So the best motor to get for performance is the 2.4 96 and up
the 2.3 quad is putting 160 HP and the 2.4 Twin cam is 150. when i say twin cam i mean it says "Twin Cam" on the IDI cover......the quads said "Quad 4" on the IDI cover.
FOR SALE: (5) '95-'99 Z24 Rims
Well technically the 2.3 HO would be best for street performance. The reason it may be a better platform is stated in the FAQ page
FAQ wrote:No balance shafts, 10:1 compression pistons (2.4 have 9.5:1), Differnet camshafts, Smaller pulley, Better flowing cyl head, Higher redline, Better intake manifold (flowing), Better exhaust manifold (flowing)
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Madjack wrote:Like I said before, building an engine like ours (2.2 or 2200) is a painstaking chore , since there is so few custom made parts. It's frustrating to me too, but that's what I like about doing this engine, it's the challenge.
The misinformation is rampant in this thread!!
The 95 2.3L Quad 4 in the J's had either 140 or 145 hp. Not quite sure. Certainly not 160. The most powerful stock j-body in terms of hp is the 2.0 turbo Sunbird GT's which had 160 hp. Next down is the 150 hp 2.4L Twin Cam's from 96-02, followed by several cars in the 140-145 range (3.1L v6 and 2.2L Ecotec included).
As far as which is the best to buy now to mod... if it was me, I'd get an Ecotec. To make up your own mind, get into the performance forums and read around to see what's being done and what's available out there.
Robert RAINEY wrote:So the best motor to get for performance is the 2.4 96 and up
I see your a newbie and I'm going to teach you something about the modifying world, there is no BEST motor or BEST modification or BEST setup, get rid of that word. Any J-body motor built correctly can outperform each other, just because the 2.4 motor starts out with 10 more horsepower than the ECOTEC doesn't make it a better motor. In reality, if you find a 2.4 motor used it probably has mid-high mileage and with wear and tear it probably doesn't have exactly 150 HP anymore.
Also, having 150 HP doesn't really make that motor a "performance" motor. I'm not trying to dog the 2.4 motor but it's true...150 HP isn't that much power to really boast about. A true "performance" engine is built properly and will exceed stock settings to really lay down some power.
If you want a good platform to start from, buy a low mileage ECOTEC motor and build it up. GM offers so many parts and soon to offer a Supercharger for it as well as a reflash. If you want to know more about what's available read
The Full ECOTEC Build Guide for all the information you need on that motor.
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
The Ecotec engine is by far the best cavalier engine
It's like a L4 version of the 350 Chevy Small Block
<img src="http://membres.lycos.fr/fuzymio/cavalier/signature.jpg" />
Ohh ok I'm gonna do that but thats what I'm saying even though the z24s make showroom power most people on here seem to going to the ecotecs and I'm wondering is that b/c they modd better or have a better platform for hp in the end or what?
Robert RAINEY wrote:Ohh ok I'm gonna do that but thats what I'm saying even though the z24s make showroom power most people on here seem to going to the ecotecs and I'm wondering is that b/c they modd better or have a better platform for hp in the end or what?
Both motors (2.4 and 2.2 ECO) take modifications pretty much the same especially cause they have basically the same computers (perameters). And like said before, they made 150 HP brand new...if you have 80,000 miles on your motor, I doubt you still have the same amount of horsepower. It's the small differences between the 2.4 and the ECO that some might think the ECO will performs better in the long run.
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
ok first off the lo quad made 155 just like every other "twin cam" i had to get that out..second i have to disagree with the "ecotec is the best to go with"...sure.if you want an engine thats gonna last and last ill hand it too ya...but he asked for the BEST jbody for performance...i say..a 95 Jbody several reasons....
first it comes with a OBD1 and can take a CHIP instead of a REFLASH ..second you have more engine options..it comes with a quad,u dont like it? slap a HO or better yet a W41!! in there with almost no modification!!! itll run off the stock computer! dont want a HO? (for some dumb reason) you can even put a 96-99 twin cam in it ..also no mods needed...you dont like the transmission?? slap a 92-94 getrag in there and run!! also..NO MOD NEEDED! .........need i say more???
"Freedom 'ought to have its limits"-George W. Bush may 31 1999 (who voted for this idiot?)
scott trent wrote:ok first off the lo quad made 155 just like every other "twin cam" i had to get that out..second i have to disagree with the "ecotec is the best to go with"...sure.if you want an engine thats gonna last and last ill hand it too ya...but he asked for the BEST jbody for performance...i say..a 95 Jbody several reasons....
first it comes with a OBD1 and can take a CHIP instead of a REFLASH ..second you have more engine options..it comes with a quad,u dont like it? slap a HO or better yet a W41!! in there with almost no modification!!! itll run off the stock computer! dont want a HO? (for some dumb reason) you can even put a 96-99 twin cam in it ..also no mods needed...you dont like the transmission?? slap a 92-94 getrag in there and run!! also..NO MOD NEEDED! .........need i say more???
What is best and what is your opinion of the best are entirely 2 different things. Like I said before, there is no best...some people like this motor, some people like that motor, it's all in the eye of the beholder.
Yes, it would be great to run a W41 motor but good luck finding one. The fact is the amount of money you spend on a motor, trans, computer etc etc you can build up your current motor.
I'm not trying to put down your idea of what is "best" but the fact is, there is no such thing as "best" in the modifying world. I'm trying to show the newer people this so in the future they don't ask questions like "what is the best header?" and "what is the best intake?".
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
i realize that...no argument..im simply going by numbers..simple numbers..and its not hard to find those engines..i got MY engine/tranny setup for $400 flat with 60k on them....i later upgraded to a better tranny 250 ....w41 cams.300 ..not hard to find..no more expensive than the rest...make more power??? ohhh yess
"Freedom 'ought to have its limits"-George W. Bush may 31 1999 (who voted for this idiot?)
scott trent wrote:i realize that...no argument..im simply going by numbers..simple numbers..and its not hard to find those engines..i got MY engine/tranny setup for $400 flat with 60k on them....i later upgraded to a better tranny 250 ....w41 cams.300 ..not hard to find..no more expensive than the rest...make more power??? ohhh yess
Sounds like you got a good deal but if you look at it from someone who is new to cars and they spend all that money and have no idea how to swap things over and how to change their computer from OBDII to OBDI, they are going to spend an arm & a leg at a shop to do all this work.
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
About the ECOtec Engine
GM Sport Compact Performance Build Book wrote:The engine is the heart of a competition car. It must be
capable of delivering full power reliably run-after-run on race
day, at engine and vehicle speeds far in excess of those
encountered in normal driving. Every part of a competition
engine must be as nearly perfect as possible – the slightest
failure can put you out of the running or even out of the race.
Since 1955, the Small Block Chevy has proven its versatility,
durability, and performance potential with automotive
performance enthusiasts. The ECOTEC engine has all the
basic mechanical components to repeat this success. A
sound base engine structure, excellent airflow capability,
easy serviceability, compact size and low weight. These
qualities, along with the very successful race program,
demonstrate the ECOTEC is a driving force in the Sport
Compact Segment. (Fig. 2)
GM’s ECOTEC engine has proven to be a reliable and
competitive engine for use in the Sport Compact Drag
Racing Series. It has also proven it’s superior durability in
grueling five mile runs at the Bonneville Salt Flats with
speeds over 300 MPH and in showroom stock endurance
road racing competition. The number of stock components
utilized in the race engine demonstrates the robust design
of the ECOTEC engine.
The ECOTEC’s outstanding feature to performance
enthusiasts is it’s impressive strength. GM Racing
dynamometer tests confirm that major horsepower gains
are possible with minimal modifications. For instance, when
building an ECOTEC engine to the 400 hp power level, no
modifications to the cylinder head, block, main girdle or
crankshaft are required.
The production ECOTEC engine block is manufactured out
of aluminum using a lost-foam casting process. This
process allows for both a stronger and lighter part. Flanged,
thin-wall iron cylinder sleeves are press-fit into a
semi-floating aluminum support structure. The ECOTEC
block is supported by a massive die-cast aluminum girdle/
main cap assembly and structural oil pan for noise and
vibration suppression. The main-cap structures are each
supported with six fasteners. Extra-thick main bearings
resist the differential thermal expansion of the nodular iron
crank and aluminum block.
All ECOTEC blocks are cast with passages for
piston-cooling jets and an oil cooler for high-output
turbocharged applications. The fully-boxed block requires
no windage tray, even on applications up to 600
horsepower. An auxiliary chain drives the water pump and
balance shafts from the crank.
To reduce the risk of hot spots, pressure-cast, non-squish
dished pistons are manufactured without valve reliefs. The
symmetrical, barrel-faced moly-coated top ring fits in an anodized ring-groove below a super-thin 3mmtop ring land,
creating a low crevice volume for reduced emissions. The
pistons deliver power through full-floating piston pins and
powder-metal or forged steel connecting rods.
The ECOTEC twin-cam cylinder head uses low-friction
hydraulic roller finger-followers, which have been proven
reliable and effective up to 11,000 rpm. Head fastener
placement permits cylinder head removal and installation
without removing the camshafts. The camshafts are driven
directly off the crank by a chain. The design includes
provisions for future upgrading to variable cam phasing. The
finger-follower design permits a light-weight narrow profile
and reduced valve angles(the intake valve is 18 degrees
from vertical and the exhaust valve 16 degrees).
The design of the intake manifold eliminates the need for
variable-length intake runners and consideration has been
made for conversion to gasoline direct-injection.
The ECOTEC engine management system uses a port-EFI
design with cassette waste-spark ignition. An integral
compression-sense ignition module eliminates the need for
a cam position sensor.
The current 2.2L version of the ECOTEC is available in the
following vehicles:
• Chevy – Cobalt, Malibu and Cavalier
• Pontiac – Grand Am and Sunfire
• Saturn – L-Series, Ion and Vue
• Opel/Vauxhal – Vectra, Zafira and Speedster.
The next several sections of this publication focus on
performance modifications for the 2.2L ECOTEC engine
installed in a 2005 Chevy Cobalt. The modifications shown
could be performed on a number of GM vehicles.
See your local GM dealer for more information on ordering
a vehicle equipped with the ECOTEC engine.
Quoted from a GM book.
<img src="http://membres.lycos.fr/fuzymio/cavalier/signature.jpg" />
ok...read my original post again....its says..and i quote...
Quote:
first it comes with a OBD1 and can take a CHIP instead of a REFLASH
second quote
Quote:
slap a HO or better yet a W41!! in there with almost no modification
you do not need to change computers and you do not need to mod anything...breaking it down..if you can take the engine OUT..you can put the new one IN..NO MODS.
"Freedom 'ought to have its limits"-George W. Bush may 31 1999 (who voted for this idiot?)
FIRST OF ALL, All the @!#$ j-body people on here are some kind of honda rejects or something, god damn. No wonder all of these memebers get @!#$ talked about them not knowing anything. FIRST OF ALL, the ecotec is a decent motor ; will last etc etc but on any good day with a great driver a z24 will rape them, and also the 2.3 LO quad 4 motor than came in the 1995 z24 had 150 hp 150 tq stock the 2.4 has 150hp and 155 tq stock to get that straight. The 1995 quad 4 has alot of @!#$ to be done do it, like first of all upgrading all of these part to HO parts off an older HO engine, like most of these 2.4s they have to mod their engine to put these parts on , the 1995 quad is just bolt on and go. the quad 4 motor has alot of history and they do last if you take care of them Every @!#$ gm faggot also says bull@!#$ like they dont last because they are @!#$ dick suckers. Let's all race, me , you with your eco@!#$ and me with my quad 4 and see who comes out on top, the ecotec only feels quick because of their toruqe and thats it. so go drive a 2.3 quad and tell me what chu think, peace out
scott trent wrote:ok...read my original post again....its says..and i quote...
Quote:
first it comes with a OBD1 and can take a CHIP instead of a REFLASH
second quote
Quote:
slap a HO or better yet a W41!! in there with almost no modification
you do not need to change computers and you do not need to mod anything...breaking it down..if you can take the engine OUT..you can put the new one IN..NO MODS.
My mistake...I assumed the person was talking abou getting an 3rd gen cavalier, not a 2nd Gen Cavalier. You are correct.
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
ok mathieums...i can tell you got that from GM..cus they say that about every engine they put out..want me to quote what all they said about the quad when IT came out??? i dont think i have to.....lets do some simple grade school math here....ecotec=140..
quad HO= 180 thats 40 HP! hell lets get a w41 thats 50..if i pulled up beside you in a stock w41 equiped car and you were driving your ecotec..would REALLY think you would win????
"Freedom 'ought to have its limits"-George W. Bush may 31 1999 (who voted for this idiot?)
animal krack3r wrote:FIRST OF ALL, All the @!#$ j-body people on here are some kind of honda rejects or something, god damn. No wonder all of these memebers get @!#$ talked about them not knowing anything. FIRST OF ALL, the ecotec is a decent motor ; will last etc etc but on any good day with a great driver a z24 will rape them, and also the 2.3 LO quad 4 motor than came in the 1995 z24 had 150 hp 150 tq stock the 2.4 has 150hp and 155 tq stock to get that straight. The 1995 quad 4 has alot of @!#$ to be done do it, like first of all upgrading all of these part to HO parts off an older HO engine, like most of these 2.4s they have to mod their engine to put these parts on , the 1995 quad is just bolt on and go. the quad 4 motor has alot of history and they do last if you take care of them Every @!#$ gm faggot also says bull@!#$ like they dont last because they are @!#$ dick suckers. Let's all race, me , you with your eco@!#$ and me with my quad 4 and see who comes out on top, the ecotec only feels quick because of their toruqe and thats it. so go drive a 2.3 quad and tell me what chu think, peace out
First of all, calm down...it's not that serious. No one is bitching or yelling at each other, we are simply having a discussion without calling names to each other like you all of a sudden have. If you disagree with something we say, be mature and tell us why. Coming off and saying that we are "Honda Rejects" is not necessary and really doesn't make any sense.
Second, if you don't like people on this website or don't like the website itself, leave...if you think that we are a bunch of little kids and all we do is bitch, you're not looking so smart yourself by staying here.
Third, I really hope you don't go around in real life and talk crap and cursing everytime you disagree with what someone says. Grow up and conversate like an Adult.
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
animal krack3r wrote:FIRST OF ALL, All the @!#$ j-body people on here are some kind of honda rejects or something, god damn. No wonder all of these memebers get @!#$ talked about them not knowing anything. FIRST OF ALL, the ecotec is a decent motor ; will last etc etc but on any good day with a great driver a z24 will rape them, and also the 2.3 LO quad 4 motor than came in the 1995 z24 had 150 hp 150 tq stock the 2.4 has 150hp and 155 tq stock to get that straight. The 1995 quad 4 has alot of @!#$ to be done do it, like first of all upgrading all of these part to HO parts off an older HO engine, like most of these 2.4s they have to mod their engine to put these parts on , the 1995 quad is just bolt on and go. the quad 4 motor has alot of history and they do last if you take care of them Every @!#$ gm faggot also says bull@!#$ like they dont last because they are @!#$ dick suckers. Let's all race, me , you with your eco@!#$ and me with my quad 4 and see who comes out on top, the ecotec only feels quick because of their toruqe and thats it. so go drive a 2.3 quad and tell me what chu think, peace out
Man,
you're not even comparing apples with apples...
The 2.4 have more displacement than the ecotec!
The ecotec is a good base if you want to get it turbo!
Hahn RaceCraft have a nice bolt-on turbo kit that will make any ecotec rock!
If you take the 2.4l ecotec engine
That engine have 175 HP and 165 lb-ft
Opel have 200+HP 2.0l Ecotec N/A engine
So the 2.4 ecotec > 2.4
<img src="http://membres.lycos.fr/fuzymio/cavalier/signature.jpg" />
oh and i missed a part..a 95 IS a 3rd gen cavy..with a obd1 ..and a quad...just the little mixed up MUT bastard aint it
"Freedom 'ought to have its limits"-George W. Bush may 31 1999 (who voted for this idiot?)
scott trent wrote:i can tell you got that from GM..cus they say that about every engine they put out..
That's true...GM would boast about every motor that they bring out but it is a good motor none the less.
www.kronosperformance.com / 732-742-8837
